| Veganuary 2020 12:16 - Jan 4 with 19458 views | J2BLUE |
Lets try and keep this civil people. The meat eaters versus vegans thing has been done to death. Most of the board have nothing new to add. If you feel compelled to reply telling us how you're knee deep in chicken wings that is entirely your choice.
Anyone doing it? Just tried the new Costa vegan 'cheese' and 'ham' toastie. I hope they keep it. It's good enough to for me to choose regularly.
Any decent product suggestions? Recipe ideas? etc [Post edited 5 Jan 2020 13:41]
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:01 - Jan 6 with 828 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Veganuary 2019 on 10:58 - Jan 6 by monytowbray |
https://www.instagram.com/p/B0EiNaThB8o/?igshid=1hpsqnexgmr9w
Honestly, I’ve tried to explain over and over. I’ve tried giving examples. I am an ex meat eater. I didn’t wake up in this world vegan. I’m not sure what else I can say that qualifies my position as someone experienced in this area vs someone just raising points in regards to things they’ve never tried.
Quorn fish fingers are better than the actual ones. Less slimy and more crispy. Beyond meat burgers are bloody lovely, as are the L Mac ones. I doubt any kid is eating gourmet quality meat burgers and one thing I learned about them when I went vegan is surprisingly condiments do more for the taste of a burger than the patty a lot of the time. |
You’re not qualified though as you’re not the parent of a small child (I am aware btw that you did find out that you were a parent last year but clearly that scenario is a bit different)
Ergo consistently telling 2 parents how qualified you are to tell them how easy it is for someone in a family to just turn vegan is rather laughable |  |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:03 - Jan 6 with 824 views | monytowbray |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:01 - Jan 6 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
You’re not qualified though as you’re not the parent of a small child (I am aware btw that you did find out that you were a parent last year but clearly that scenario is a bit different)
Ergo consistently telling 2 parents how qualified you are to tell them how easy it is for someone in a family to just turn vegan is rather laughable |
I’m qualified to tell you what options there are out there and how to do it from the food I eat. Feel free to test it and let me know how it goes. I’d genuinely be surprised if you came back here and said it was a total disaster.
I’m actually against people doing vegan cold turkey, most people that show interest I recommend they phase it by switching products gradually or doing a few vegan days a week. [Post edited 6 Jan 2020 11:04]
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:05 - Jan 6 with 815 views | itfcjoe |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:03 - Jan 6 by monytowbray |
I’m qualified to tell you what options there are out there and how to do it from the food I eat. Feel free to test it and let me know how it goes. I’d genuinely be surprised if you came back here and said it was a total disaster.
I’m actually against people doing vegan cold turkey, most people that show interest I recommend they phase it by switching products gradually or doing a few vegan days a week. [Post edited 6 Jan 2020 11:04]
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I think it would need to be a two step process personally, via vegetarianism - I think it would be impossible to go straight to it with 2 small children.
Maybe if my wife wasn't at work it may be a bit easier as you can try and make the changes more gradually - but would be a nightmare to do in one hit with no real time to work through it. I'd worry about children not having dairy personally as think it still does them a lot of good at a young age
EDIT - And re your edited point, I'm amazed people are able to successfully do Vegan for a month from nowhere, it strikes me as utterly bonkers and an almost impossible task [Post edited 6 Jan 2020 11:06]
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:08 - Jan 6 with 802 views | monytowbray |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:05 - Jan 6 by itfcjoe |
I think it would need to be a two step process personally, via vegetarianism - I think it would be impossible to go straight to it with 2 small children.
Maybe if my wife wasn't at work it may be a bit easier as you can try and make the changes more gradually - but would be a nightmare to do in one hit with no real time to work through it. I'd worry about children not having dairy personally as think it still does them a lot of good at a young age
EDIT - And re your edited point, I'm amazed people are able to successfully do Vegan for a month from nowhere, it strikes me as utterly bonkers and an almost impossible task [Post edited 6 Jan 2020 11:06]
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I had many failed attempts at veganism for a few years because of the sudden change method. If you cook something new and mess it up or don’t like it it’s game over. Where the phased approach means you have some room for trial and error. | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:12 - Jan 6 with 790 views | DanTheMan |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:08 - Jan 6 by monytowbray |
I had many failed attempts at veganism for a few years because of the sudden change method. If you cook something new and mess it up or don’t like it it’s game over. Where the phased approach means you have some room for trial and error. |
I'm by no means Vegan but if people are interested I'd recommend going this way. I've cut down quite a bit just through gradually doing meals from cook books without meat and finding what I liked and didn't like.
Bosh ones are good for that as a lot of the recipes weren't "X but without meat", just good dishes by themselves that didn't happen to have meat in them.
Onion Bhaji burgers in particular were my favourite. |  |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:12 - Jan 6 with 790 views | eireblue |
| Veganuary 2019 on 10:48 - Jan 6 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Where everyone wants them without meat or just one person? |
I guess this discussion depends on the definition of “too hard”.
Some people think it isn’t too hard and think it is possible.
It may be a question of experience.
But most vegans I know of, aren’t born vegan, and have to go through the process of both becoming vegan themselves, and optionally brining along other family members.
It is possible. Also in some cases, it also depends on other family members wanting to be vegan.
I have family friends that have vegan children.
I also have friends that have members of their family that have decided they need to be gluten free.
Are these things possible to cope with, yes.
Could these be too hard for some people, I guess they would have to try, to find that out. |  | | |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:14 - Jan 6 with 787 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:00 - Jan 6 by monytowbray |
The M&S chicken per pound is no less expensive than actual chicken. And there are even cheaper options out there too, that’s just my personal favourite.
The more you reply on this thread the clearer it is you really should try these things out and see for yourself rather than making hypothetical arguments that have no actual reality. |
And that’s where you go wrong by assuming rather than asking about circumstance
Like many, my views on this have softened over time. I eat much less meat now - mainly as I got rather fed up with eating chicken pretty much every day but for some other reasons too. My partner is semi-veggie in that she doesn’t really like most meat dishes and often prefers substitutes - we probably average a couple of veggie dishes a week and I’m quite happy to have the substitutes on occasion (similarly I prefer the Quorn chicken pieces to actual chicken in some dishes)
I’m quite happy to be upfront that I wouldn’t go full vegan through choice - as noted in my reply to J2 earlier I enjoy dairy far too much and truth be told do still very much enjoy a good steak, bacon sandwich or burger far too much, not to mention fish which I’ve tended to eat a lot more of in lieu of meat of late
Still, even if I was prepared to become a vegan, it’s already clear from the faff we have making some dinners currently how much effort would be needed to separately feed me, my wife and child. Not to mention the amount of times where we have to nip to the small shop over the road to grab some quick bits for dinner owing to time pressures etc - said shop not exactly being blessed with vegan options unsurprisingly. I would suggest those kinds of issues apply to an awful lot of people
IMO, it’s plainly not easy for your average person in a family to turn vegan, for the reasons stated. Or indeed anyone really without a great amount of effort or dedication
Even your M&S example is misleading - having looked at the prices on the plant kitchen items before its certainly not cheaper than the chicken a lot of families would buy, and even if it was other things in the store are far more expensive when doing the weekly shop | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:15 - Jan 6 with 785 views | DanTheMan |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:12 - Jan 6 by eireblue |
I guess this discussion depends on the definition of “too hard”.
Some people think it isn’t too hard and think it is possible.
It may be a question of experience.
But most vegans I know of, aren’t born vegan, and have to go through the process of both becoming vegan themselves, and optionally brining along other family members.
It is possible. Also in some cases, it also depends on other family members wanting to be vegan.
I have family friends that have vegan children.
I also have friends that have members of their family that have decided they need to be gluten free.
Are these things possible to cope with, yes.
Could these be too hard for some people, I guess they would have to try, to find that out. |
Must say, my partner is Coeliac which complicates vegan stuff a bit, as they tend to make use of gluten's stretchy qualities quite often. | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:19 - Jan 6 with 775 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Veganuary 2019 on 10:55 - Jan 6 by Herbivore |
I guess that partly depends on the strength of feeling. If your kids are old enough to feel that strongly about wanting to eat meat then encourage them to cook for themselves, I did when I decided to turn vegetarian.
I guess what I'm saying is it's quite easy to find reasons to not do something you don't actually want to do. Nothing you're raising is remotely insurmountable or even close to it. I've had more than one relationship with a meat eater and it's never been a problem. |
Missed this reply but yes absolutely depends on strength of feeling. If the family are prepared to do so then clearly it isn’t an issue, but I don’t believe that would be typical of the norm
Obviously if someone feels strongly enough then absolutely it can be done, however it’s ridiculous to pretend it wouldn’t involve a great deal of time and effort in the family scenario, not to mention the potential for it to become an issue with relationships etc (obviously there’s a separate argument there around whether a relationship where that happens is healthy however that doesn’t change the point that it’s clearly not an easy to just do) | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:29 - Jan 6 with 749 views | Herbivore |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:19 - Jan 6 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Missed this reply but yes absolutely depends on strength of feeling. If the family are prepared to do so then clearly it isn’t an issue, but I don’t believe that would be typical of the norm
Obviously if someone feels strongly enough then absolutely it can be done, however it’s ridiculous to pretend it wouldn’t involve a great deal of time and effort in the family scenario, not to mention the potential for it to become an issue with relationships etc (obviously there’s a separate argument there around whether a relationship where that happens is healthy however that doesn’t change the point that it’s clearly not an easy to just do) |
On the relationship front I can say from experience that it is in fact very easy. I guess it really depends on your definition of what constitutes something being really hard. Most family meals like spag bol, chilli, even freezer dinners of chips, protein and peas/beans can very easily be made vegan. If your kids are old enough to strongly object to eating meat substitutes then encourage them to start making some meals for themselves. Younger kids will barely (if at all) notice that you've used soya mince rather than beef mince in their shepherd's pie. You don't have to do separate meals for everyone. |  |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:32 - Jan 6 with 738 views | Ryorry |
| Veganuary 2019 on 07:17 - Jan 6 by NewcyBlue |
If you want to talk food, I’m all for it.
I am a massive foodie, I happily experiment with recipes, and could quite easily go vegetarian.
Not vegan though. I respect the choice you have made, you struggled to begin with and persisted. That’s commendable. But the vegan lifestyle isn’t for me. Vegan food is though.
Eireblue introduced me to Tyne Chease and I get a block every leave. |
Tyne Chease is brilliant, but the company has a serious production problem in terms of supply & demand. I rang up to order some about 3-4 weeks before Christmas, was told they were out of stock on everything, and that I had to ring back on one Friday morning only - a 3 hr time window, in order to place my name on an order list, no prior requests possible. Needless to say I forgot, or was out or something. Imagine what the Dragons in their Den would say about any company following that business model! |  |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:37 - Jan 6 with 723 views | Herbivore |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:32 - Jan 6 by Ryorry |
Tyne Chease is brilliant, but the company has a serious production problem in terms of supply & demand. I rang up to order some about 3-4 weeks before Christmas, was told they were out of stock on everything, and that I had to ring back on one Friday morning only - a 3 hr time window, in order to place my name on an order list, no prior requests possible. Needless to say I forgot, or was out or something. Imagine what the Dragons in their Den would say about any company following that business model! |
They are currently all small producers and demand is starting to grow quicker than they can. I slightly prefer I Am Nut OK cheese to Tyne Chease, and they had similar issues with stock over Christmas. It's still largely an artisan product. | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 11:51 - Jan 6 with 711 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:29 - Jan 6 by Herbivore |
On the relationship front I can say from experience that it is in fact very easy. I guess it really depends on your definition of what constitutes something being really hard. Most family meals like spag bol, chilli, even freezer dinners of chips, protein and peas/beans can very easily be made vegan. If your kids are old enough to strongly object to eating meat substitutes then encourage them to start making some meals for themselves. Younger kids will barely (if at all) notice that you've used soya mince rather than beef mince in their shepherd's pie. You don't have to do separate meals for everyone. |
Serious question but do you have kids? Otherwise I’d politely suggest you don’t have experience
I think you’d be surprised by how picky children can be. As an example, my child (who generally has quite a wide-ranging palette) will eat shepherds or cottage pie with mince, but refuses to eat a veggie version my wife makes on occasion using Quorn Mince
That isn’t just meat/non-meat either - chicken normally flies down but the rosemary and thyme roast chicken made yesterday was point blank refused after a bite
Fully agree that children cooking is to be encouraged but having to do so to support your own vegan choice again rather undermines the point that it’s simple and easy to do... | |
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| Veganuary 2020 on 12:06 - Jan 6 with 705 views | Lord_Lucan |
I would do but I’m knee deep in chicken wings****
**** I haven’t read all the thread as it’s taking about 5 minutes to load a page so I apologise if someone else has already come up with this hilarious reply. |  |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 12:09 - Jan 6 with 697 views | Herbivore |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:51 - Jan 6 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Serious question but do you have kids? Otherwise I’d politely suggest you don’t have experience
I think you’d be surprised by how picky children can be. As an example, my child (who generally has quite a wide-ranging palette) will eat shepherds or cottage pie with mince, but refuses to eat a veggie version my wife makes on occasion using Quorn Mince
That isn’t just meat/non-meat either - chicken normally flies down but the rosemary and thyme roast chicken made yesterday was point blank refused after a bite
Fully agree that children cooking is to be encouraged but having to do so to support your own vegan choice again rather undermines the point that it’s simple and easy to do... |
Maybe you need to employ a bit of tough love. | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 12:11 - Jan 6 with 693 views | monytowbray |
| Veganuary 2019 on 11:51 - Jan 6 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
Serious question but do you have kids? Otherwise I’d politely suggest you don’t have experience
I think you’d be surprised by how picky children can be. As an example, my child (who generally has quite a wide-ranging palette) will eat shepherds or cottage pie with mince, but refuses to eat a veggie version my wife makes on occasion using Quorn Mince
That isn’t just meat/non-meat either - chicken normally flies down but the rosemary and thyme roast chicken made yesterday was point blank refused after a bite
Fully agree that children cooking is to be encouraged but having to do so to support your own vegan choice again rather undermines the point that it’s simple and easy to do... |
There are better mince subs than Quorn these days, if anything Quorn has really slipped behind the market as most products aren’t vegan and the texture/taste isn’t near as good as some of the new products. I’d be amazed if there isn’t a mince substitute you could lie to your kid about. I never eat fake mince so can’t suggest anything but I’m sure someone here could. | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 12:20 - Jan 6 with 684 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Veganuary 2019 on 12:09 - Jan 6 by Herbivore |
Maybe you need to employ a bit of tough love. |
My child is 2 - I can’t exactly force feed him and if I don’t feed him something else he’ll be a) hungry and b) an incredibly cranky nightmare due to point a | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 12:29 - Jan 6 with 674 views | NewcyBlue |
| Veganuary 2019 on 12:09 - Jan 6 by Herbivore |
Maybe you need to employ a bit of tough love. |
Forcing a child to eat something is a no no.
That’s why we always put out extra veg. I know why veg Seb likes. If he doesn’t like what I cook, he can have the veg.
He likes what I cook though. I know what to make him, because I involve him in the cooking.
When he says “I only like my schools chicken curry” I ask him why it is so good?
When I got round to making chicken curry I had him describe what it looked like and tasted like, and cooked a chicken curry. He gobbled it down. Part of it may be because I had him describe what it looked and tasted like, thus making him think and taste those things.
But I like to think it’s because I have involved him and given him ownership of his food choices. Which is what I do at every meal.
We have sit down meals, at a table. He doesn’t at his Mums. I think meal times are an important part of family life, and by forcing him to eat something that is unpalatable to him would ruin that.
It’s not tough love that is needed, it’s giving the children ownership of their choices.
I won’t make a different meal for Seb and one for MrsN and I, we all eat the same. They get options and we all have an input. Seb understands that his input is important to us and will be taken into consideration. |  |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 12:37 - Jan 6 with 661 views | Herbivore |
| Veganuary 2019 on 12:20 - Jan 6 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
My child is 2 - I can’t exactly force feed him and if I don’t feed him something else he’ll be a) hungry and b) an incredibly cranky nightmare due to point a |
That was meant as a joke. I am aware that children can be fussy, though again I don't think that's entirely insurmountable. | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 12:38 - Jan 6 with 657 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Veganuary 2019 on 12:20 - Jan 6 by C_HealyIsAPleasure |
My child is 2 - I can’t exactly force feed him and if I don’t feed him something else he’ll be a) hungry and b) an incredibly cranky nightmare due to point a |
Why would anyone force feed a 2 year old a vegan diet? I would look at it the same way as I look at religion. I didn’t have my kids Chrisened as I thought when they are old enough they can decide themselves what God they want to follow if they decide to.
Bunch of arse. | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 12:39 - Jan 6 with 652 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Veganuary 2019 on 12:37 - Jan 6 by Herbivore |
That was meant as a joke. I am aware that children can be fussy, though again I don't think that's entirely insurmountable. |
Again though - not ‘entirely insurmountable’ is somewhat different to it being easy, which remains the point that I was making | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 12:39 - Jan 6 with 649 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Veganuary 2019 on 12:38 - Jan 6 by Lord_Lucan |
Why would anyone force feed a 2 year old a vegan diet? I would look at it the same way as I look at religion. I didn’t have my kids Chrisened as I thought when they are old enough they can decide themselves what God they want to follow if they decide to.
Bunch of arse. |
There was that too but I didn’t want to go down that road! | |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 12:40 - Jan 6 with 646 views | Herbivore |
| Veganuary 2019 on 12:29 - Jan 6 by NewcyBlue |
Forcing a child to eat something is a no no.
That’s why we always put out extra veg. I know why veg Seb likes. If he doesn’t like what I cook, he can have the veg.
He likes what I cook though. I know what to make him, because I involve him in the cooking.
When he says “I only like my schools chicken curry” I ask him why it is so good?
When I got round to making chicken curry I had him describe what it looked like and tasted like, and cooked a chicken curry. He gobbled it down. Part of it may be because I had him describe what it looked and tasted like, thus making him think and taste those things.
But I like to think it’s because I have involved him and given him ownership of his food choices. Which is what I do at every meal.
We have sit down meals, at a table. He doesn’t at his Mums. I think meal times are an important part of family life, and by forcing him to eat something that is unpalatable to him would ruin that.
It’s not tough love that is needed, it’s giving the children ownership of their choices.
I won’t make a different meal for Seb and one for MrsN and I, we all eat the same. They get options and we all have an input. Seb understands that his input is important to us and will be taken into consideration. |
See my reply to Healy, I'm not actually in favour of a tough love approach. Choices are good, it's usually adults setting what the choices are (which is important) but it also gives kids ownership and responsibility. | |
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| Veganuary 2020 on 12:42 - Jan 6 with 645 views | Reuser_is_God |
| Veganuary 2020 on 12:06 - Jan 6 by Lord_Lucan |
I would do but I’m knee deep in chicken wings****
**** I haven’t read all the thread as it’s taking about 5 minutes to load a page so I apologise if someone else has already come up with this hilarious reply. |
Was a sensible thread actually, then Callis got involved. |  |
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| Veganuary 2019 on 12:44 - Jan 6 with 631 views | C_HealyIsAPleasure |
| Veganuary 2019 on 12:11 - Jan 6 by monytowbray |
There are better mince subs than Quorn these days, if anything Quorn has really slipped behind the market as most products aren’t vegan and the texture/taste isn’t near as good as some of the new products. I’d be amazed if there isn’t a mince substitute you could lie to your kid about. I never eat fake mince so can’t suggest anything but I’m sure someone here could. |
Will have to give it a whirl - have noticed some of the plant based stuff in Sainsbury’s too that to the eye looks like mince and was intrigued as to how it tastes cooked. Haven’t yet taken the plunge
Similarly I’ve been meaning to try the vegan stack from TFI Vegan for a while but on the rare occasions I’m buying lunch in town I’m invariably drawn to either the Philippines stand or the goat curry. That’s more to do with rarely fancying a burger for lunch mind you
Again though at the risk of sounding like a stuck record - the substitute options aren’t generally that cheap in most supermarkets, and trial and error to find stuff that you like is quite obviously much easier for an individual or open minded couple than your average family dynamic | |
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