| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? 19:03 - Jan 27 with 10693 views | Mullet |
That's Millwall of all teams tearing away our best player for years, and seemingly for a fraction of what he could have cost Brum not that long ago.
Could the brass at the club really have asked for more? Seems the loan deal deadline was cock up, and that's played right into Millwall's hands. I'm not expecting mega money, but on top of all the TV money we're down this season, it's a nice little reminder how bad it'll get next season if we stay down.
Is it even worth getting upset about, when we can effectively just add it to the bill we've been racking up for over a season now? |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 02:33 - Jan 28 with 3407 views | Illinoisblue |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 23:17 - Jan 27 by istanblue |
Well and truly I'm afraid. This club has been a soft touch for a long time and this is merely another example of it. Some points to illustrate how bad this deal is:
Loan recall deadline. What was the point of having it if not to either recall Bart and sell to a higher bidder or use it as leverage to extract more money from Millwall?
~900k fee. What a pathetically small fee. A 3 time Player of the Season going for a pittance when he's played well and become a solid fan favourite!? Do me a favour. Yes he's 32 but that's a good age for a GK.
Wage argument. Yes he is our top earner but surely Millwall are paying (at least the majority) of his wages whilst he is there. Why not reassess the situation in the summer?
Millwall. I know they're having a decent season but they ain't gonna be top 6 come the end of the season. This isn't a West Brom or a Leeds who are seriously looking for promotion so the old 'he's doing it to better his career' argument really doesn't stack up. Also worth pointing out we are now losing our best player (over recent seasons at least) to the likes of MILLWALL ffs!
He could've still played for us again. Should we gain promotion (which I think is more than a realistic prospect), he could well have been our #1 in the Championship next season.
Money won't be reinvested. I seriously doubt the money made from this transfer will be reinvested in to making an adequate addition to the squad. At best it will be a cheap loan.
All in all this a bad deal, and don't let the likes of Evans, O'Neill or even Lambert spin tell you any different. |
And who was the higher bidder? |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 07:39 - Jan 28 with 3355 views | Steve_M |
The big failing was making him our highest paid player rather than selling him in the Summer of 2018. The standard lack of a joined up approach since Evans has been at the club ends up costing him more.
That Summer's transfer business was the worst since 2001, hopefully it won;t end up hurting us for as long. |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 07:39 - Jan 28 with 3351 views | hampstead_blue |
I thought Millwall played a blinder but also showed us up for being poor negotiators.
1) Refused the initial transfer - very thin excuse
2) Took him on loan - clearly wanted him and have them a chance to warm him up to a move
3) Lowball us in Jan - we rolled over and took yet another spanking
Poor transfer dealing is more than just a pattern, it's almost a policy.
We do need to start selling when we are in a better position - Dids is an example. |  |
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Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 08:04 - Jan 28 with 3335 views | BiGDonnie |
He was far from our best player for the last couple of seasons. We've done well to get as much as we did for him. |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 08:25 - Jan 28 with 3325 views | N2_Blue |
The amount of bed wetting over this transfer is ridiculous. I love how so many who have absolutely no idea about the dealings of transfers feel they can advise what the club should have done. How do you know that this was not the best or only deal possible. His wages are huge for a club in our position.
This is a player that was dreadful for us in our last season and didn’t help our cause in a relegation season.
The issue here is not so much that the club have screwed up a dealing it’s the fact we were relegated. Sometimes transfers don’t happen when a multi million pound bit is made, such as for Dids and Bart, but unfortunately it does not mean you will be able to seek a similar deal 12 months down the line. It’s life. Moving Bart on to Millwall leaves us in a better position financially than him not moving on. Yes we all want more money for the club but sometimes you just have to look at the situation. L1 clubs don’t tend to get overly large fees and certainly not for a GK who clubs know we need to get off our books |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 08:28 - Jan 28 with 3318 views | Guthrum |
I don't know how far we have been ripped off, if at all.
The Brum valuation of summer 2018 was at the peak of Bialkowski's worth, thrice Player of the Season, just been to the World Cup. Since then he had a poor season ending in relegation. He seemingly went from being determined upon staying at Town to wanting to leave, despite the lucrative new contract.
Fast-forward to January 2020 and I'm not sure how much competition Millwall really had for his signature (Cardiff and Blackburn's offers may have been lower still). He's also six months further into his contract than the summer, which will discount the price a bit. |  |
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| Hear hear on 08:37 - Jan 28 with 3311 views | unstableblue |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 08:25 - Jan 28 by N2_Blue |
The amount of bed wetting over this transfer is ridiculous. I love how so many who have absolutely no idea about the dealings of transfers feel they can advise what the club should have done. How do you know that this was not the best or only deal possible. His wages are huge for a club in our position.
This is a player that was dreadful for us in our last season and didn’t help our cause in a relegation season.
The issue here is not so much that the club have screwed up a dealing it’s the fact we were relegated. Sometimes transfers don’t happen when a multi million pound bit is made, such as for Dids and Bart, but unfortunately it does not mean you will be able to seek a similar deal 12 months down the line. It’s life. Moving Bart on to Millwall leaves us in a better position financially than him not moving on. Yes we all want more money for the club but sometimes you just have to look at the situation. L1 clubs don’t tend to get overly large fees and certainly not for a GK who clubs know we need to get off our books |
Bart was a much loved player, who was fantastic for us for many seasons. He was player of the season due to some of his heroics and excellent shot stopping, within two extremely drab and damaging seasons for the fan base.
But his final season here was terrible, with multiple mistakes costing us significant points. Now this may have been down to the truly woeful man management of Paul Hurst and his side kick, but the player has to take some responsibility. We had to get him off the wage bill after out relegation, and thank goodness Millwall viewed his whole form at ITFC not just his final season.
There is a lot of speculation about the transfer dealing, if we did miss some revenue opportunity via a mistake, then lessons need to learnt. But I'm not sure the fans know the real detail.
For now our goalkeeping department is in rude health by all accounts, including excellent youth coming through.
Lets be positive. And look ahead to whats important and thats getting something from tonight at Rotherham. |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 08:39 - Jan 28 with 3305 views | GaryCooper |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 19:52 - Jan 27 by Mullet |
Who else on the books has won POTY 3 times on the spin then? |
When the goalkeeper wins that award three years on the spin it highlights just how poor we were at the time, Bart was ok but doesn't get into our top ten keepers. |  | | |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 08:50 - Jan 28 with 3290 views | Kieran_Knows |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 07:39 - Jan 28 by Steve_M |
The big failing was making him our highest paid player rather than selling him in the Summer of 2018. The standard lack of a joined up approach since Evans has been at the club ends up costing him more.
That Summer's transfer business was the worst since 2001, hopefully it won;t end up hurting us for as long. |
Although I dread to think who Hurst would've signed with another £3m in his kitty!
*waits patiently for PositivePortman to come along and tell me that I need to get over Hurst ..... |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 08:51 - Jan 28 with 3283 views | Herbivore |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 08:39 - Jan 28 by GaryCooper |
When the goalkeeper wins that award three years on the spin it highlights just how poor we were at the time, Bart was ok but doesn't get into our top ten keepers. |
Which ten were better? And blimey, if you think we were poor when we were top half in the Championship I dread to think what you must think of the current side! |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:07 - Jan 28 with 3268 views | BrixtonBlue |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 08:25 - Jan 28 by N2_Blue |
The amount of bed wetting over this transfer is ridiculous. I love how so many who have absolutely no idea about the dealings of transfers feel they can advise what the club should have done. How do you know that this was not the best or only deal possible. His wages are huge for a club in our position.
This is a player that was dreadful for us in our last season and didn’t help our cause in a relegation season.
The issue here is not so much that the club have screwed up a dealing it’s the fact we were relegated. Sometimes transfers don’t happen when a multi million pound bit is made, such as for Dids and Bart, but unfortunately it does not mean you will be able to seek a similar deal 12 months down the line. It’s life. Moving Bart on to Millwall leaves us in a better position financially than him not moving on. Yes we all want more money for the club but sometimes you just have to look at the situation. L1 clubs don’t tend to get overly large fees and certainly not for a GK who clubs know we need to get off our books |
Indeed, and bed wetting over an undisclosed fee! |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:12 - Jan 28 with 3261 views | GaryCooper |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 08:51 - Jan 28 by Herbivore |
Which ten were better? And blimey, if you think we were poor when we were top half in the Championship I dread to think what you must think of the current side! |
Roy Bailey, David Best,Paul Cooper, Richard Wright, Kelvin Davis, Craig Forrest, Matteo Sereni, Asmir Begovic, Phil Parkes, Martin Fulop.
That is just off the top of my head, Laurie Sivell nearly made the list.
If a teams goalkeeper stands out, and then is awarded player of the year three times in succession what on earth does that state about the team? Especially as his distribution was non league standard. [Post edited 28 Jan 2020 9:14]
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:34 - Jan 28 with 3231 views | Radlett_blue |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 23:29 - Jan 27 by agentp |
Why are we a soft touch?
Bart has an agent who would have touted Bart to other clubs. Bigger the fee the bigger the sign on. Clearly, no one else wanted him. That agent would also have been part of the loan agreement. We needed him off the books - that was worth over a million and this was the best option at the time for ITFC, Bart and Barts agent.
The club doesn't place a figure on a players head. Interest raises it - the agents raise it. Demand decides it. He had a poor season last season and his value was shot. We are now trading in hindsight.
I don't want to depress you further but the figure isn't 900k and Milwall are in the Championship. I am sure Bart doesn't give a Fcuk if whether they should be bigger than us or not he wants to play at as high a level as he can, to pursue his international career. That last sentence BTW reduces the price further. [Post edited 27 Jan 2020 23:33]
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For a player to move - either on loan or permanently - both clubs & the player have to agree. Yes, Millwall played a fast one by touting an ancient, near irrelevant injury to dodge paying the agreed fee, but we were silly with the nature of the recall clause & how we failed to use it. But the big problem was that Bart probably didn't fancy a move away from the South East, which reduced the number of clubs willing to buy or take the player on loan. Millwall became the only buyer & Evans was desperate to shift the highest earner at the club.
The real error was in giving a huge contract to someone at the time who was no more than a decent 2nd tier keeper, given the financial constraint under which we operate, but player management has been the biggest weakness of the Evans era & it certainly hasn't improved since Evans started doing it himself as it's clear he know sweet FA about football. |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:43 - Jan 28 with 3216 views | Bluemike31 |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 19:52 - Jan 27 by Mullet |
Who else on the books has won POTY 3 times on the spin then? |
Just because he won POTS 3 times means nothing, he had one good season when he deservedly won it, the other two should have been won by Lawrence & Waghorn but in true Ipswich fans tradition they vote for their favs as opposed to the real players deserving of it. If winning POTS meant anything how do you explain Chambo winning it last year when most fans give him real stick all the time ? It's a farce.
As for what we got for Bart, I would say anything around the 750 -900k mark is good business for a keeper who cant, kick, punch, command his area, talk to his defence and who has made dozens of ricks in recent times, I am not bothered if he has played well for Millwall, he needed to leave us. |  | | |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:44 - Jan 28 with 3216 views | PJH |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 08:39 - Jan 28 by GaryCooper |
When the goalkeeper wins that award three years on the spin it highlights just how poor we were at the time, Bart was ok but doesn't get into our top ten keepers. |
Your top ten keepers should be interesting then because I go back about 60 years with ITFC and I would have him in my top five. |  | | |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:46 - Jan 28 with 3222 views | itfcjoe |
He was gone in the summer, Lambert doesn't rate him for what he wants and his wages are out of kilter for the value he brings.
If we were to go up, his wage returns to the higher level it was at and we are stuck paying a load for a keeper the manager doesn't want.
The fee isn't great, but in the summer when it was quoted I don't think too many people were that bothered. the loan clause seems silly, and seems as though we haven't got similar with Norris which is even more baffling
Bart has probably been the best keeper I've watched for Town, ahead of Wrighty, but I'm not too bothered he has gone and think it has worked out about right - remember how dreadful he was last year, whatever the excuses he cost us points in key games and his form, under both managers, was partly responsible for our relegation |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:51 - Jan 28 with 3195 views | PJH |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:12 - Jan 28 by GaryCooper |
Roy Bailey, David Best,Paul Cooper, Richard Wright, Kelvin Davis, Craig Forrest, Matteo Sereni, Asmir Begovic, Phil Parkes, Martin Fulop.
That is just off the top of my head, Laurie Sivell nearly made the list.
If a teams goalkeeper stands out, and then is awarded player of the year three times in succession what on earth does that state about the team? Especially as his distribution was non league standard. [Post edited 28 Jan 2020 9:14]
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Phil Parkes based on his three games for ITFC?
Bergovic based on what he did at ITFC?
Might as well include John Jackson and Pollitt as well then.
Of your list I would only put Bailey, Wright and Davis certainly ahead of him and most of the others certainly behind him. | | | |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:55 - Jan 28 with 3184 views | Radlett_blue |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:51 - Jan 28 by PJH |
Phil Parkes based on his three games for ITFC?
Bergovic based on what he did at ITFC?
Might as well include John Jackson and Pollitt as well then.
Of your list I would only put Bailey, Wright and Davis certainly ahead of him and most of the others certainly behind him. |
It's all about opinion & a goalkeeper's job has changed completely since the back pass law as altered, but to suggest that Bart is/was a better keeper than Paul Cooper is strange.
I agree with you that counting players who played a handful of games for Town is stranger. | |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 10:00 - Jan 28 with 3167 views | GaryCooper |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:44 - Jan 28 by PJH |
Your top ten keepers should be interesting then because I go back about 60 years with ITFC and I would have him in my top five. |
Fair enough, opinions dear boy, Bart in his last season was abysmal, perhaps my judgement is coloured by that disaster? His communication with his defence and control of his box was always poor, but even that was not as poor as his distribution.
Yeah not in my top ten. | | | |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 10:08 - Jan 28 with 3166 views | PhilTWTD |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 09:46 - Jan 28 by itfcjoe |
He was gone in the summer, Lambert doesn't rate him for what he wants and his wages are out of kilter for the value he brings.
If we were to go up, his wage returns to the higher level it was at and we are stuck paying a load for a keeper the manager doesn't want.
The fee isn't great, but in the summer when it was quoted I don't think too many people were that bothered. the loan clause seems silly, and seems as though we haven't got similar with Norris which is even more baffling
Bart has probably been the best keeper I've watched for Town, ahead of Wrighty, but I'm not too bothered he has gone and think it has worked out about right - remember how dreadful he was last year, whatever the excuses he cost us points in key games and his form, under both managers, was partly responsible for our relegation |
From what I gather the initial fee is a fair way off what the deal was in the summer, the £500,000 being quoted by some Millwall sources sounds about right. Further cash from top-ups further along the line which could make it more lucrative but not the deal which was quoted in the summer.
Agree with your overall point about his wages and potentially being stuck with them, although I think there would have been other interested parties in the summer.
Think the short recall window clause was part of a protracted negotiation regarding the loan in the summer. I think it was a difficult deal to do and the two parties didn't entirely see eye to eye after the way the initial permanent deal broke down.
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 10:48 - Jan 28 with 3087 views | PJH |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 10:00 - Jan 28 by GaryCooper |
Fair enough, opinions dear boy, Bart in his last season was abysmal, perhaps my judgement is coloured by that disaster? His communication with his defence and control of his box was always poor, but even that was not as poor as his distribution.
Yeah not in my top ten. |
I agree about Bart's last season because if he had continued as he had been for the previous two and a bit seasons he would have been even higher in my list of ITFC goalkeepers but as you correctly say it is opinions. | | | |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 11:17 - Jan 28 with 3067 views | No9 |
Maybe it comes down to BB fittning into the new Town structure + of course ££.
Whilst many of us thought he was an excellent GK he did have his detractors and returned from the WC less than the GK he had been in the preceding season - how much of that was down to that decline was down to the attitude of the regime at the time = we shall probably never know.
Nut if he is happy & team management are happy the obvious solution is to let BB earn a decent living & move on.
Our sights should be set on the future | | | |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 11:24 - Jan 28 with 3053 views | chicoazul |
Pure speculation on my part but maybe his new contract didn't have a relegation clause on wages reduction? Mullers is right though it's a perfect example of how far we have fallen, seeing him go to bluddy Milwall of all places. |  |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 12:44 - Jan 28 with 3012 views | judespiveyg |
| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 22:41 - Jan 27 by Herbivore |
That we were a top half Championship team? Less than two years ago, although it feels a lot longer. |
Ah yes, 16th, the top half of a 24 team division. That was incidentally the only year he deserved it. 17/18 Waghorn was easily our best player. 15/16 Bialkowski played less than half of our games. |  |
| I survived Ipswich 0-0 Burton |
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| How badly have we been ripped off by Millwall then? on 12:48 - Jan 28 with 3009 views | judespiveyg |
I'm not too fussed. It's a shame because he seemed like a good guy and frequently made spectacular saves. His wages can't have been little though. Add that to the fact he was never great off his line to command his area. His kicking wasn't always convincing either. | |
| I survived Ipswich 0-0 Burton |
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