| Well done Paul Cook! 17:31 - Mar 23 with 8317 views | Chrisd |
Chesterfield back in the EFL after 6 seasons. I still believe he started the change at our club, he had to make those tough decisions to start our climb upwards. Look at the players he brought in, some of those players still having an impact at the top of the Championship. |  |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 12:51 - Mar 24 with 1038 views | Trequartista |
I think you can credit him for the clearout and partial credit for the recruitment, but everything on the pitch was pretty terrible. It just doesn't work sometimes for managers even if they've proved themselves elsewhere.
*Maybe* he would have turned it round given more time, but you don't base manager decisions on the fairness to a manager, you base them on what's best for the club, and it turns out we made one of the best decisions ever to sack him, harsh though that may sound. |  |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 13:39 - Mar 24 with 988 views | ibbleobble |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 12:51 - Mar 24 by Trequartista |
I think you can credit him for the clearout and partial credit for the recruitment, but everything on the pitch was pretty terrible. It just doesn't work sometimes for managers even if they've proved themselves elsewhere.
*Maybe* he would have turned it round given more time, but you don't base manager decisions on the fairness to a manager, you base them on what's best for the club, and it turns out we made one of the best decisions ever to sack him, harsh though that may sound. |
A good balanced post which I agree with. I’d give him slightly more credit for ‘his’ recruitment though. I’d argue the main stay of the squad now were his signings, which I think goes to show the approach / philosophy was right, even if the execution was laboured. | | | |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 14:06 - Mar 24 with 948 views | Herbivore |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 11:41 - Mar 24 by The_Flashing_Smile |
When you call him "tactically clueless" then it's relevant to bring up his successes. Unless you think it's possible to forget everything you know, then you need to look deeper to the reasons behind failure.
Jewell had almost 2 years.
I'm not arguing because I backed him. I back all managers and believe in giving them time. Always have done, often to my detriment.
My point is there's reasons, context and nuance as to why he failed, all of which you dismiss or ignore. Your view is simplistic. |
There's always reasons and context for any manager failing, I wouldn't suggest the mitigation for Cook is much greater than any other manager who has failed here given how significantly he was backed to build his own squad.
I don't know how many times I have to repeat this, but I'm commenting on his time here and not his body of work at other clubs, and I think tactically clueless is a fair description of how his teams looked here. If you disagree, please provide some evidence from his time here to the contrary. |  |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 16:05 - Mar 24 with 889 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 12:22 - Mar 24 by WestStanderLaLaLa |
Too right he didn’t get a tune out of them. He averaged half a point a game worse than Lambert. That’s a stark statistic. |
Lambert had 2.5 years, a much longer timespan to get things right.
Lambert also had 5 transfer windows to Cook's one.
So not a fair comparison IMO. |  |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 16:12 - Mar 24 with 885 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 14:06 - Mar 24 by Herbivore |
There's always reasons and context for any manager failing, I wouldn't suggest the mitigation for Cook is much greater than any other manager who has failed here given how significantly he was backed to build his own squad.
I don't know how many times I have to repeat this, but I'm commenting on his time here and not his body of work at other clubs, and I think tactically clueless is a fair description of how his teams looked here. If you disagree, please provide some evidence from his time here to the contrary. |
Where we disagree is there is a lot more mitigation for Cook IMO.
He had 5 months of playing time, with 2 different teams (the first very poor and needing replacing) and 1 transfer window.
In comparison Jewell had 2 years and 4 windows.
Lambert had 2.5 years and 5 windows. [Post edited 24 Mar 16:13]
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| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 17:55 - Mar 24 with 843 views | Churchman |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 16:12 - Mar 24 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Where we disagree is there is a lot more mitigation for Cook IMO.
He had 5 months of playing time, with 2 different teams (the first very poor and needing replacing) and 1 transfer window.
In comparison Jewell had 2 years and 4 windows.
Lambert had 2.5 years and 5 windows. [Post edited 24 Mar 16:13]
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Ah, but Lambert had no money and all the windows in the world will not bring in the players Cook was able to without £. No excuses for Lambert though. He was beyond awful.
It’s all opinion but for me, it was the opportunity Cook had against what he actually did that leads me to believe he had no idea whatsoever. Yes, he has an eye for a player and yes, at the right club he’s a great fit as his track record proves.
But here? There are no mitigations for me. He went about it all wrong and was in trouble within a couple of months of joining and dead man walking by October.
Collecting players and hoping they’ll become a team just like that was ridiculous. It was kid in a sweetshop stuff. Fortunately, his good judge of a player gave KM something to work with, but that’s no mitigation. That’s just good fortune for KM and us.
No, for opportunity v outcomes, there aren’t many that have done a worse job here. We were in League One with a budget dwarfing most others. Yet there we were scraping a draw against Morecambe and losing at Burton and Cheltenham. It wasn’t good.
But he seems a nice bloke, KD likes him, he’s done well at Chesterfield so well done him and all the ex ITFC people |  | | |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 18:04 - Mar 24 with 832 views | MK1 |
Being totally honest, I was glad to see him go. |  | | |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 18:13 - Mar 24 with 821 views | ibbleobble |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 17:55 - Mar 24 by Churchman |
Ah, but Lambert had no money and all the windows in the world will not bring in the players Cook was able to without £. No excuses for Lambert though. He was beyond awful.
It’s all opinion but for me, it was the opportunity Cook had against what he actually did that leads me to believe he had no idea whatsoever. Yes, he has an eye for a player and yes, at the right club he’s a great fit as his track record proves.
But here? There are no mitigations for me. He went about it all wrong and was in trouble within a couple of months of joining and dead man walking by October.
Collecting players and hoping they’ll become a team just like that was ridiculous. It was kid in a sweetshop stuff. Fortunately, his good judge of a player gave KM something to work with, but that’s no mitigation. That’s just good fortune for KM and us.
No, for opportunity v outcomes, there aren’t many that have done a worse job here. We were in League One with a budget dwarfing most others. Yet there we were scraping a draw against Morecambe and losing at Burton and Cheltenham. It wasn’t good.
But he seems a nice bloke, KD likes him, he’s done well at Chesterfield so well done him and all the ex ITFC people |
He did it twice before though and got teams promoted doing it so why did it not work here? | | | |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 18:14 - Mar 24 with 821 views | Swansea_Blue |
A decent, old school, lower leagues manager. He was clearly not going to take us anywhere, but he’ll do fine bouncing around between L1 and L2. I don’t think there are any mitigating factors that suggest he was hard done by here or that justify his very average tenure. He’d just reached his ceiling, and that’s fine. The team he put together around him should have been a sign. KM is light years ahead.
I don’t wish him ill though. He tried, came up short and did a few good things that have helped us out now (not least signing Wes, Hladky, Burgess, Morsy and Conor. He definitely gets a thumbs up from me for that lot - they’re the core of the team that’s done so well since). |  |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 18:44 - Mar 24 with 792 views | WestStanderLaLaLa |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 16:05 - Mar 24 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Lambert had 2.5 years, a much longer timespan to get things right.
Lambert also had 5 transfer windows to Cook's one.
So not a fair comparison IMO. |
Lambert was rubbish. Cook did worse with the same players. |  |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 18:52 - Mar 24 with 785 views | itfcjoe |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 09:44 - Mar 24 by _clive_baker_ |
‘by all accounts worked 24/7 whilst at the club to do his best‘.
Not sure that aligns with the thoughts on a number of people at the club!! |
Or at Ipswich Golf Club, or Ipswich Sports Club….or numerous other watering holes.
The only time people I directly know have seen McKenna out and about in a social setting is at something like Clip n Climb with his kids in a Sunday morning, and even then he was still watching back the previous days game! An absolute workaholic, and if people think Cook worked 24/7 then what do they think KM is doing?! |  |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 19:16 - Mar 24 with 756 views | Churchman |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 18:13 - Mar 24 by ibbleobble |
He did it twice before though and got teams promoted doing it so why did it not work here? |
We discussed this on the other thread so I’ll try not to bore more than usual by repeating myself.
I’ll sum it up by saying in addition to that, wrong club, wrong time, wrong place, wrong circumstances. | | | |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 19:30 - Mar 24 with 739 views | Herbivore |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 16:12 - Mar 24 by The_Flashing_Smile |
Where we disagree is there is a lot more mitigation for Cook IMO.
He had 5 months of playing time, with 2 different teams (the first very poor and needing replacing) and 1 transfer window.
In comparison Jewell had 2 years and 4 windows.
Lambert had 2.5 years and 5 windows. [Post edited 24 Mar 16:13]
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Fair enough. The counter argument to that would be, just imagine how crap you have to be to get sacked even quicker than showers of sh!te like Lambert and Jewell. | |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:04 - Mar 24 with 708 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 19:30 - Mar 24 by Herbivore |
Fair enough. The counter argument to that would be, just imagine how crap you have to be to get sacked even quicker than showers of sh!te like Lambert and Jewell. |
Herbz. That's only because of the take over tho.
If we are to believe he wasn't in the take over plans to begin with and it was solely Evans choice.. I don't think Evans would have pulled the plug so soon after binning off 19 players. Despite it ending well.. it was still way to early to sack a manager after such a summer window.
We are thankful for it now of course. |  |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:14 - Mar 24 with 700 views | GlasgowBlue |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 09:44 - Mar 24 by _clive_baker_ |
‘by all accounts worked 24/7 whilst at the club to do his best‘.
Not sure that aligns with the thoughts on a number of people at the club!! |
I was going by what Alan Lee said in an interview. That Paul Cook was first and last at the training ground and that right up until his sacking he was driving around the country scouting players and watching our opposition. |  |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:20 - Mar 24 with 691 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 17:55 - Mar 24 by Churchman |
Ah, but Lambert had no money and all the windows in the world will not bring in the players Cook was able to without £. No excuses for Lambert though. He was beyond awful.
It’s all opinion but for me, it was the opportunity Cook had against what he actually did that leads me to believe he had no idea whatsoever. Yes, he has an eye for a player and yes, at the right club he’s a great fit as his track record proves.
But here? There are no mitigations for me. He went about it all wrong and was in trouble within a couple of months of joining and dead man walking by October.
Collecting players and hoping they’ll become a team just like that was ridiculous. It was kid in a sweetshop stuff. Fortunately, his good judge of a player gave KM something to work with, but that’s no mitigation. That’s just good fortune for KM and us.
No, for opportunity v outcomes, there aren’t many that have done a worse job here. We were in League One with a budget dwarfing most others. Yet there we were scraping a draw against Morecambe and losing at Burton and Cheltenham. It wasn’t good.
But he seems a nice bloke, KD likes him, he’s done well at Chesterfield so well done him and all the ex ITFC people |
You've missed my point though. He had 5 months of playing time and 1 window. Of course that's a mitigating factor. He had no time to gel those new players. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:30 - Mar 24 with 676 views | Herbivore |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:20 - Mar 24 by The_Flashing_Smile |
You've missed my point though. He had 5 months of playing time and 1 window. Of course that's a mitigating factor. He had no time to gel those new players. |
The gelling thing rings a bit hollow, he took 7 points from his last 6 games and 3 of those were in a really spawny home win against a terrible Crewe side. We were going backwards at that point. McKenna came in and had us looking cohesive almost immediately. | |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:32 - Mar 24 with 675 views | Mookamoo |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 12:51 - Mar 24 by Trequartista |
I think you can credit him for the clearout and partial credit for the recruitment, but everything on the pitch was pretty terrible. It just doesn't work sometimes for managers even if they've proved themselves elsewhere.
*Maybe* he would have turned it round given more time, but you don't base manager decisions on the fairness to a manager, you base them on what's best for the club, and it turns out we made one of the best decisions ever to sack him, harsh though that may sound. |
He would have been able to turn it around, but it would have taken a lot longer, and be considerably uglier.
My guess is a Cook's Ipswich would be where Peterborough are now. And next year, a healthy 14th in the Championship |  | | |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:34 - Mar 24 with 671 views | The_Flashing_Smile |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 19:30 - Mar 24 by Herbivore |
Fair enough. The counter argument to that would be, just imagine how crap you have to be to get sacked even quicker than showers of sh!te like Lambert and Jewell. |
I suspect it's because Ashton had his man lined up as much as Cook not turning things around quickly enough.
And of course it was Ashton doing the sacking. The other two were under Evans... who bizarrely gave Lambert a 5 year extension!
After bombing out the old lot and buying in a whole new team he got just 4 months with them before he was sacked. Whilst I'm obviously delighted with how things worked out from our POV, no-one will ever convince me that was a fair amount of time to gel a completely new team.
Of course, he may have continued to be not good enough, we'll never know. | |
| Trust the process. Trust Phil. |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:43 - Mar 24 with 658 views | _clive_baker_ |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 18:52 - Mar 24 by itfcjoe |
Or at Ipswich Golf Club, or Ipswich Sports Club….or numerous other watering holes.
The only time people I directly know have seen McKenna out and about in a social setting is at something like Clip n Climb with his kids in a Sunday morning, and even then he was still watching back the previous days game! An absolute workaholic, and if people think Cook worked 24/7 then what do they think KM is doing?! |
I think he and Ian Craney thought they were on freshers week for the most part. Not that people can’t have a life out of football, but I know there were crossed words with the powers that be.
I did see McKenna in a pub once to be fair, in his first post season break. Looked very much like family meal vibes rather than a stag do though. |  | | |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:51 - Mar 24 with 639 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:34 - Mar 24 by The_Flashing_Smile |
I suspect it's because Ashton had his man lined up as much as Cook not turning things around quickly enough.
And of course it was Ashton doing the sacking. The other two were under Evans... who bizarrely gave Lambert a 5 year extension!
After bombing out the old lot and buying in a whole new team he got just 4 months with them before he was sacked. Whilst I'm obviously delighted with how things worked out from our POV, no-one will ever convince me that was a fair amount of time to gel a completely new team.
Of course, he may have continued to be not good enough, we'll never know. |
Seems a strange hill to die on buh. Cook 4 wins in his first 16 games in 20/21 season and then 7 wins in 23 in 21/22. KM comes in with the same team, wis 6 of his his first 8 and then never looked back.
The reality was he wasn't up to it. | |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:55 - Mar 24 with 628 views | Churchman |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 20:20 - Mar 24 by The_Flashing_Smile |
You've missed my point though. He had 5 months of playing time and 1 window. Of course that's a mitigating factor. He had no time to gel those new players. |
Ah, Flash, I’m good at missing the point!
The thing is though he chose to go about it in the way he did. I also don’t think his team would have gelled however long he’d been here. They were no more a team in November than they had been in August. There were the hidings of Portsmouth, Wycombe and Donny but in between?
It just didn’t feel right and it was for me opportunity v outcome and I didn’t think he was good enough while he was here. He had to go. | | | |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 22:13 - Mar 24 with 556 views | WestStanderLaLaLa |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 18:44 - Mar 24 by WestStanderLaLaLa |
Lambert was rubbish. Cook did worse with the same players. |
Down vote it all you like, it’s a matter of fact that Cooks PPG were less than Lamberts that season. | |
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| Well done Paul Cook! on 06:19 - Mar 25 with 484 views | Chocorange |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 22:13 - Mar 24 by WestStanderLaLaLa |
Down vote it all you like, it’s a matter of fact that Cooks PPG were less than Lamberts that season. |
Lamberts PPG in our relegation season were even worse than Hurst’s , let that sink in.
Like it or not Cook has plenty of mitigating circumstances over a much shorter time. |  | | |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 06:28 - Mar 25 with 478 views | textbackup |
| Well done Paul Cook! on 22:39 - Mar 23 by GlasgowBlue |
Cook was awful mate. 3 points off the play offs with a game in hand when he was appointed and we sank like a stone. Ripped the squad apart and bolloxed that up again.
That said, he was a genuinely nice man and by all accounts worked 24/7 whilst at the club to do his best, and I’m happy for his recent success.
Anyway, I trust I’ll see you at Blackburn on Friday? |
He was a massive pisshead that got barred from multiple pubs.
He and the scouse mafia spent most evenings absolutely trollied.
That said, whenever I met him he was nice to chat with.
Got rid of the dead wood at the club, started our journey to where we are now.
Neither like or dislike him. |  |
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