| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 15:56 - Feb 29 with 1620 views | textbackup |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 12:43 - Feb 29 by bluelagos |
Or that anyone really gives a toss that a play about slavery has chosen to reserve a couple of nights for the sole viewing of black people?
Snowflake central innit. |
Now just imagine the shoe was on the other foot… |  |
|  |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:01 - Feb 29 with 1591 views | ChorleyBoy |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 15:48 - Feb 29 by Herbivore |
I've explained myself twice now, including why what they are doing can be described as inclusive (it opens it up to a wider audience and encourages a minoritised group to access it). I stand by those explanations, which also cover the questions you've asked. You disagree as you are welcome to, but it seems we've reached an impasse. |
I have no problem with your explanation. I have a problem with exclusion of one group in order to allow the supposed "inclusion" of another. I see little difference to the theatre's way of promoting inclusivity to the football example I gave in my previous post. Again, real inclusion (which is what we all want) is not achieved by exclusion. |  | | |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:07 - Feb 29 with 1553 views | Herbivore |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:01 - Feb 29 by ChorleyBoy |
I have no problem with your explanation. I have a problem with exclusion of one group in order to allow the supposed "inclusion" of another. I see little difference to the theatre's way of promoting inclusivity to the football example I gave in my previous post. Again, real inclusion (which is what we all want) is not achieved by exclusion. |
As I said, we've reached impasse because I've addressed all of your points and you still disagree and I don't agree with your take either, despite you repeating it. Enjoy the rest of your day. |  |
| |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:12 - Feb 29 with 1530 views | ChorleyBoy |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:07 - Feb 29 by Herbivore |
As I said, we've reached impasse because I've addressed all of your points and you still disagree and I don't agree with your take either, despite you repeating it. Enjoy the rest of your day. |
You support inclusivity of one group through the exclusion of another. I think that only creates division. You disagree.
We agree that an impasse has been reached and that we should both have a good day. LOL | | | |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:15 - Feb 29 with 1514 views | Herbivore |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:12 - Feb 29 by ChorleyBoy |
You support inclusivity of one group through the exclusion of another. I think that only creates division. You disagree.
We agree that an impasse has been reached and that we should both have a good day. LOL |
You clearly haven't taken on board anything I've said and are trying to reduce a complex issue into simple binaries. That's why we've reached impasse. I still wish you a good day nonetheless. | |
| |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:23 - Feb 29 with 1485 views | textbackup |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 13:46 - Feb 29 by Herbivore |
No, absolutely not, although certain posters who seem to agree with that sentiment were very vocal that feminists shouldn't be calling out Brendan Rodgers because the female journalist he condescended to wasn't offended by it. Some people need to make up their minds!
There is also a question as to whether this really constitutes racism in any meaningful sense, given that the audience is for people who identify as Black for only two showings of the play, meaning white people can go and watch it any other time they want. I don't think white people are really missing out here in any meaningful way.
People also don't seem to be able to engage with the context here. It's like if there was a play about rape or domestic abuse, they might offer a couple of women only showings because some women might not feel comfortable engaging with the content in an audience with men. The intention is to be inclusive of people who are likely to be affected by the play's content because of issues of power and victimisation. |
Can only women be raped, or face domestic abuse?
News to me if so | |
| |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:26 - Feb 29 with 1471 views | DJR |
This from BTL at the Guardian.
So, If I've got this right, the Government are OK with...
Men only clubs that won't admit women.
Women only spaces that won't admit trans women.
Statues of slave traders.
But they're not ok with...
Two shows out of a three month run of a play about race, slavery, and identity being aimed at an “all-black-identifying audience”? |  | | |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:27 - Feb 29 with 1457 views | Herbivore |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:23 - Feb 29 by textbackup |
Can only women be raped, or face domestic abuse?
News to me if so |
Nowhere have I said only women can be raped or face domestic abuse, however they are statistically much more likely to be victims than men, and men are much, much more likely to be the perpetrators of rape and domestic abuse as well.
Glad that white men have got you fighting their corner though, heaven knows they need all the help they can get, being such a marginalised group and all. | |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:48 - Feb 29 with 1397 views | textbackup |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:27 - Feb 29 by Herbivore |
Nowhere have I said only women can be raped or face domestic abuse, however they are statistically much more likely to be victims than men, and men are much, much more likely to be the perpetrators of rape and domestic abuse as well.
Glad that white men have got you fighting their corner though, heaven knows they need all the help they can get, being such a marginalised group and all. |
I reckon they will have a ‘black only night’ because on those shows the slaves will be white, to get their own back.
Be a laugh actually I reckon | |
| |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:51 - Feb 29 with 1381 views | Herbivore |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:48 - Feb 29 by textbackup |
I reckon they will have a ‘black only night’ because on those shows the slaves will be white, to get their own back.
Be a laugh actually I reckon |
Yeah, that would definitely be payback for actual slavery for sure. | |
| |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 17:34 - Feb 29 with 1335 views | ChorleyBoy |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:15 - Feb 29 by Herbivore |
You clearly haven't taken on board anything I've said and are trying to reduce a complex issue into simple binaries. That's why we've reached impasse. I still wish you a good day nonetheless. |
If it were a complex issue, I don't think you'd have explained it twice to me in just a few lines. I've taken on board everything you've said, which wasn't much, and disagree that this is an intelligent or effective way to provide inclusiveness for certain West End theatre goers. In fact, it just creates greater division. Anyway, despite our positions on this and the fact that it's early evening, I still wish you a good day too. LOL | | | |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 17:36 - Feb 29 with 1330 views | textbackup |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:51 - Feb 29 by Herbivore |
Yeah, that would definitely be payback for actual slavery for sure. |
I wouldnt worry mate, you weren’t involved | |
| |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 17:42 - Feb 29 with 1303 views | Trequartista |
Futher and further beyond the looking glass. |  |
| |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 17:48 - Feb 29 with 1284 views | MattinLondon |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 17:36 - Feb 29 by textbackup |
I wouldnt worry mate, you weren’t involved |
Is that how history works? If someone wasn’t involved then they can’t feel repulsed about certain events or share an opinion? |  | | |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 18:51 - Feb 29 with 1218 views | noggin |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 17:48 - Feb 29 by MattinLondon |
Is that how history works? If someone wasn’t involved then they can’t feel repulsed about certain events or share an opinion? |
Yeah, all that remembering the war dead nonsense. Let it go! |  |
| |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 19:06 - Feb 29 with 1192 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 15:56 - Feb 29 by textbackup |
Now just imagine the shoe was on the other foot… |
I think that's the point, it was on the other foot, for a long time, until fairly recently. |  |
| |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 19:25 - Feb 29 with 1156 views | lowhouseblue |
the culture war deployed as free advertising. respect for that. they have the government, a football message board, and tomorrow all the national press telling people about their play. well played. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
| |
| And ultimately they'll.... on 19:29 - Feb 29 with 1134 views | Bloots |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 19:25 - Feb 29 by lowhouseblue |
the culture war deployed as free advertising. respect for that. they have the government, a football message board, and tomorrow all the national press telling people about their play. well played. |
....change their mind and not do the black out nights anyway.
As you say, great marketing. |  |
| Elite Level Poster: Elite Level Supporter: Elite Level Human |
| |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 21:02 - Feb 29 with 1055 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:48 - Feb 29 by textbackup |
I reckon they will have a ‘black only night’ because on those shows the slaves will be white, to get their own back.
Be a laugh actually I reckon |
You haven’t read what the play is about have you? |  |
| |
| And ultimately they'll.... on 22:04 - Feb 29 with 1008 views | Lord_Lucan |
| And ultimately they'll.... on 19:29 - Feb 29 by Bloots |
....change their mind and not do the black out nights anyway.
As you say, great marketing. |
This was in the news last year.
Maybe it didn’t get enough traction back then.
I think it’s wrong because it’s divisive. On a positive note though I have learnt a new saying today - The White Gaze. I’ll file that with my White Privilege as a boy that was born in Luton and grew up in Hounslow.
I suppose what makes me remotely giggle is posters digging out people who are offended but who themselves would be absolutely stabbing themselves in the eye if it was the other way around.
Personally I don’t give a sh1t.
Well, actually I think I do. I think it’s divisive.
Will there be a section on black on black slavery that was going on then - and at this point remains the biggest slave trade on the planet. |  |
| |
| And ultimately they'll.... on 22:12 - Feb 29 with 967 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| And ultimately they'll.... on 22:04 - Feb 29 by Lord_Lucan |
This was in the news last year.
Maybe it didn’t get enough traction back then.
I think it’s wrong because it’s divisive. On a positive note though I have learnt a new saying today - The White Gaze. I’ll file that with my White Privilege as a boy that was born in Luton and grew up in Hounslow.
I suppose what makes me remotely giggle is posters digging out people who are offended but who themselves would be absolutely stabbing themselves in the eye if it was the other way around.
Personally I don’t give a sh1t.
Well, actually I think I do. I think it’s divisive.
Will there be a section on black on black slavery that was going on then - and at this point remains the biggest slave trade on the planet. |
'The play by Jeremy O Harris, the US playwright, is moving from a successful run on Broadway, which yielded 12 Tony nominations. The production portrays interracial couples undergoing sexual therapy requiring them to role-play as slaves and masters.'
Edit....by the by what would the reverse scenario be? [Post edited 29 Feb 22:16]
| |
| |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 23:43 - Feb 29 with 912 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 13:25 - Feb 29 by Sarge |
Do you have to be directly affected to call out racism wherever it appears? Surely it’s everyone’s duty. |
This is nonsense on so many levels in relation to this event.
It's not racism as that is prejudice plus power. [Post edited 29 Feb 23:58]
|  | | |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 23:46 - Feb 29 with 905 views | reusersfreekicks |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 16:48 - Feb 29 by textbackup |
I reckon they will have a ‘black only night’ because on those shows the slaves will be white, to get their own back.
Be a laugh actually I reckon |
State of this | | | |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 00:50 - Mar 1 with 837 views | Sarge |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 23:43 - Feb 29 by reusersfreekicks |
This is nonsense on so many levels in relation to this event.
It's not racism as that is prejudice plus power. [Post edited 29 Feb 23:58]
|
Racism, “prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism by an individual, community, or institution against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular racial or ethnic group, typically one that is a minority or marginalized.” - Oxford English Dictionary.
We can freely debate the intent, the severity, and the impact as much as we like and likely all conclude that really, aside from being either some clumsy marketing technique or a genuine attempt for some reason to segregate the audience, this really doesn’t touch the sides on the scale of historical or institutional racism. Realistically this will have little to no effect whatsoever, as possibly as many as ten white people (and I’m assuming anyone else that isn’t black) find themselves temporarily shut out of a play on a specific night.
This particular application of racism is atypical, in that it is not deployed against a minority or marginalised group, and really nobody is going to be particularly bothered by it. But by this definition it is racism, and the power dynamic to me seems to be added later to enable the mental gymnastics of discriminating against some groups/races and not others. |  | | |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 01:05 - Mar 1 with 822 views | Sarge |
| Not sure what is more ludicrous... on 13:46 - Feb 29 by Herbivore |
No, absolutely not, although certain posters who seem to agree with that sentiment were very vocal that feminists shouldn't be calling out Brendan Rodgers because the female journalist he condescended to wasn't offended by it. Some people need to make up their minds!
There is also a question as to whether this really constitutes racism in any meaningful sense, given that the audience is for people who identify as Black for only two showings of the play, meaning white people can go and watch it any other time they want. I don't think white people are really missing out here in any meaningful way.
People also don't seem to be able to engage with the context here. It's like if there was a play about rape or domestic abuse, they might offer a couple of women only showings because some women might not feel comfortable engaging with the content in an audience with men. The intention is to be inclusive of people who are likely to be affected by the play's content because of issues of power and victimisation. |
I totally agree, I don’t think there’s any meaningful intent or malice in it at all. But as I’ve posted above just now, to me it’s still racist by definition and I’m not overly comfortable justifying that in any capacity regardless of the context or how well-meaning to some they may have perceived it to be. | | | |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
