| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? 13:45 - Dec 17 with 7948 views | unstableblue |
Seen a few threads on potential signings and what business we can do.
But I wonder just what budget and ambition the ownership group are going to sanction, and critically what does FFP do in terms of setting the boundaries.
Are they going to back McKennas higher end targets, as in Premier Ready players who’ll also drive automatic or at worst via play-offs promotion?
I wonder if the jam packed attendances, cup run, merchandise and the guarantee of Play-off attendance revenue and TV, will allow us to be more bullish?
Is there any element of gambling to get us over the line? I sense not.
In short this points lead is significant. A strong striker, AM (Broadhead, Burns and Omari are brilliant, but sometimes we’ve needed more, like yesterday), CM… it could be the difference.
Do we go for it?? Or are the FFP risks and concerns on squad cohesion too big of a concern??
I sense you’d need to let a few go. |  |
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 22:35 - Dec 17 with 1841 views | PioneerBlue |
I’m not convinced you can directly recruit for the prem in our position, there are no parachute payments and no current large sales. There is no need to do this either. We are performing exceptionally well!
The game changes immeasurably in the event of promotion. However right now we are competing to get out of the champ. If any new players recruited can take a step up that’s fab but this window must be about improving quality in the squad to get us to May, meaning greater competition for our starters and them not being slogged over as many games/ minutes, plus better quality finishers which will keep closing game levels up and help training standards.
Not saying they have to go but at a guess those under the spotlight and whose contracts close this summer are,
Evo
Ball
Donacien
You then have a few right on the fringe which could free up space, least likely is sending a loan back unless all parties came to the same view given how the landscape has changed compared to expectation,
Scarlett
Ladapo
Jackson
Edmundson [Post edited 17 Dec 2023 22:46]
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 22:46 - Dec 17 with 1811 views | Pinewoodblue |
One thing you can be certain of is that both Leicester & Leeds will spend significantly more than we do. Doubt however they will spend more wisely. |  |
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 22:53 - Dec 17 with 1801 views | unstableblue |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 22:35 - Dec 17 by PioneerBlue |
I’m not convinced you can directly recruit for the prem in our position, there are no parachute payments and no current large sales. There is no need to do this either. We are performing exceptionally well!
The game changes immeasurably in the event of promotion. However right now we are competing to get out of the champ. If any new players recruited can take a step up that’s fab but this window must be about improving quality in the squad to get us to May, meaning greater competition for our starters and them not being slogged over as many games/ minutes, plus better quality finishers which will keep closing game levels up and help training standards.
Not saying they have to go but at a guess those under the spotlight and whose contracts close this summer are,
Evo
Ball
Donacien
You then have a few right on the fringe which could free up space, least likely is sending a loan back unless all parties came to the same view given how the landscape has changed compared to expectation,
Scarlett
Ladapo
Jackson
Edmundson [Post edited 17 Dec 2023 22:46]
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I agree that the business we do in January will be very different we’d do in the summer if the Premiership is guaranteed and the financial uplift and security of several years of parachute payment to cover any outlays and wages. At that point you can go for proven Premiership quality, see Barclay at Luton.
But you can still get top Championship quality that have potential in the Premier Leavue, a la Brentford. | |
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 12:59 - Dec 18 with 1550 views | sjg |
FFP is not something that would affect us straight away, it is rolling and at any rate the only costs that we would incur are wages and amortisation of transfer fees (i.e. transfer fee divided by contract length).
If you think of it as us starting a significantly shorter season with what is guaranteed now to be at least a small advantage on 3rd we would be crazy not to spend in January, and it does appear likely that within the next couple of seasons we will be able to generate significant revenue by either getting promoted or selling players, thus offsetting any losses made under FFP in pursuit of promotion.
Couple that with how attractive a proposition we must be to any potential recruits and I wouldn't be surprised if we break our transfer record in January. | | | |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 17:19 - Dec 18 with 1411 views | GeoffSentence |
Lapapo out Batisuta in
Def Info. |  |
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 17:25 - Dec 18 with 1401 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 17:19 - Dec 18 by GeoffSentence |
Lapapo out Batisuta in
Def Info. |
La Papo?
Makes me think of that car advert. "Papa?" "Nicole?" |  |
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 19:54 - Dec 18 with 1313 views | LegendofthePhoenix |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 18:47 - Dec 17 by NthQldITFC |
I think that's the answer, but is dependent somewhat on what overseas scouting they've had in place for the last year or so. Possibly the most important aspect is personality and character which might be more difficult to do overseas, but I might hesitantly say that overseas players could have a tendency to come from a more stable environment! |
Agree that is a really interesting possibility, I believe I recall Ashton said at a recent fans evening that we were putting an overseas scouting network in place. And doesn't Pert have contacts in Brazil? As you say , keeping the team spirit and togetherness intact is key. We managed to integrate players like Muhren, Thissen, Hreidarsson, Counago, Peralta .... so it is possible if you have the right manager and culture within the group. |  |
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 20:04 - Dec 18 with 1300 views | ibbleobble |
Yes because we’re PL bound so we need to start building for the PL now, same as we did last year to prepare for The Championship. | | | |
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| POST OF THE DAY on 06:56 - Dec 19 with 1131 views | ElephantintheRoom |
| POST OF THE DAY on 14:44 - Dec 17 by unstableblue |
“What’s 99.9% certain is we’ll never go into January transfer in a stronger position”
Amen to that.
10 points is a huge gap. But the competition is fierce and we have Luongo going away.
I do agree that the project is WAY ahead of its timeline. A push for 6th place the hope perhaps |
Ahem. The franchise is. NOT way ahead of its timeline. It was one year behind the spreadsheet (and minus £12 million) getting out of a Covid-destroyed third division and (assuming promotion) is one year ahead of the spreadsheet in the second division… at the cost of another minus £12 million… the reality is that the carpetbaggers are on track for where they were told they would be ‘on the project plan’ - but are somewhat out of pocket.
Given that the pleasing level of success this season is largely down to NOT making any significant signings and going again with the successful blend they already had it kind of suggests it would be madness to add in yet more signings.
Interesting that most infantile fantasies seem to be a striker to sort out the top scoring side in the division, which would mean a poke in the eye for Hirst who has been a Town player for about 6 months and is almost certainly the biggest earner. | |
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| POST OF THE DAY on 07:28 - Dec 19 with 1079 views | LegendofthePhoenix |
| POST OF THE DAY on 06:56 - Dec 19 by ElephantintheRoom |
Ahem. The franchise is. NOT way ahead of its timeline. It was one year behind the spreadsheet (and minus £12 million) getting out of a Covid-destroyed third division and (assuming promotion) is one year ahead of the spreadsheet in the second division… at the cost of another minus £12 million… the reality is that the carpetbaggers are on track for where they were told they would be ‘on the project plan’ - but are somewhat out of pocket.
Given that the pleasing level of success this season is largely down to NOT making any significant signings and going again with the successful blend they already had it kind of suggests it would be madness to add in yet more signings.
Interesting that most infantile fantasies seem to be a striker to sort out the top scoring side in the division, which would mean a poke in the eye for Hirst who has been a Town player for about 6 months and is almost certainly the biggest earner. |
Bore off. | |
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| POST OF THE DAY on 08:01 - Dec 19 with 1030 views | redrickstuhaart |
| POST OF THE DAY on 06:56 - Dec 19 by ElephantintheRoom |
Ahem. The franchise is. NOT way ahead of its timeline. It was one year behind the spreadsheet (and minus £12 million) getting out of a Covid-destroyed third division and (assuming promotion) is one year ahead of the spreadsheet in the second division… at the cost of another minus £12 million… the reality is that the carpetbaggers are on track for where they were told they would be ‘on the project plan’ - but are somewhat out of pocket.
Given that the pleasing level of success this season is largely down to NOT making any significant signings and going again with the successful blend they already had it kind of suggests it would be madness to add in yet more signings.
Interesting that most infantile fantasies seem to be a striker to sort out the top scoring side in the division, which would mean a poke in the eye for Hirst who has been a Town player for about 6 months and is almost certainly the biggest earner. |
Surely time that this tedious troll vanished? | | | |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 08:38 - Dec 19 with 987 views | itfcjoe |
2-3 high quality additions, definitely a striker, probably a CM and maybe another wide player |  |
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:00 - Dec 19 with 944 views | jayessess |
I'm a bit sceptical of the idea that we're going to spend big in January, to be honest.
If you go through our actual first eleven (as opposed to the guys on the fringes), it's hard to see who is easily replaceable at the price points we'd be operating in, especially when you take into account the players we rotate in a lot.
Hladky: Absolutely not
Clarke/Williams Not really, not unless Williams is being sent back for some reason
Davis: No, lol
Woolfenden/Tuanzebe: No
Burgess: Not really, he's playing brilliant and Left-footed Centre Backs are gold dust
Morsy: No, obviously not
Luongo/Taylor: Conceivably, but isn't Taylor is already being queued up here?
Burns/Hutchinson: Burns illustrates his continuing importance week after week, Hutchinson is probably as good as you'd hope for in a teenage loan star
Chaplin: No
Broadhead: No, our main threat when he's on it
Hirst: No, honestly we absolutely lucked out finding one striker at Hirst's level
What would you need to spend to get in players who were significant and obvious upgrades on these guys? Chaplin, Broadhead and Hirst are posting better numbers than players who cost 8-figure fees. Meanwhile we're either having discussions about players from overseas/PL academies/League One with very limited football at this level or talking about moves for players like Szmodics that just aren't going to happen.
And if you're not improving on those 11-14 guys then you're not moving the dial on our promotion chances, not really. Sure, you might breath easier if you have better backup for Morsy or Davis, but anyone you bring in has to be willing to sit behind those two and that affects the quality/experience you can get.
Not saying we'll do no business at all (we'll almost certainly want two forwards, one on a par with Hirst to share his minutes, one nearer to Chaplin/Broadhead to share theirs), just that the window might be, for practical reasons, less ambitious than many imagine. |  |
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:12 - Dec 19 with 917 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:00 - Dec 19 by jayessess |
I'm a bit sceptical of the idea that we're going to spend big in January, to be honest.
If you go through our actual first eleven (as opposed to the guys on the fringes), it's hard to see who is easily replaceable at the price points we'd be operating in, especially when you take into account the players we rotate in a lot.
Hladky: Absolutely not
Clarke/Williams Not really, not unless Williams is being sent back for some reason
Davis: No, lol
Woolfenden/Tuanzebe: No
Burgess: Not really, he's playing brilliant and Left-footed Centre Backs are gold dust
Morsy: No, obviously not
Luongo/Taylor: Conceivably, but isn't Taylor is already being queued up here?
Burns/Hutchinson: Burns illustrates his continuing importance week after week, Hutchinson is probably as good as you'd hope for in a teenage loan star
Chaplin: No
Broadhead: No, our main threat when he's on it
Hirst: No, honestly we absolutely lucked out finding one striker at Hirst's level
What would you need to spend to get in players who were significant and obvious upgrades on these guys? Chaplin, Broadhead and Hirst are posting better numbers than players who cost 8-figure fees. Meanwhile we're either having discussions about players from overseas/PL academies/League One with very limited football at this level or talking about moves for players like Szmodics that just aren't going to happen.
And if you're not improving on those 11-14 guys then you're not moving the dial on our promotion chances, not really. Sure, you might breath easier if you have better backup for Morsy or Davis, but anyone you bring in has to be willing to sit behind those two and that affects the quality/experience you can get.
Not saying we'll do no business at all (we'll almost certainly want two forwards, one on a par with Hirst to share his minutes, one nearer to Chaplin/Broadhead to share theirs), just that the window might be, for practical reasons, less ambitious than many imagine. |
Any striker that is on par with Hirst or possibly a slight upgrade is going to cost us a few quid, unless we pull another rabbit out of the hat. I could also see Taylor being nudged forward into a 10 option and us spending a decent sum on a CM. Luongo is doing phenomenally but will be off for a month and is out of contract at the end of the season.
I don't think we will be spending £5m+ on individual players, but could easily see us having a window where we spend £5m-£8m on 2/3 players. | | | |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:17 - Dec 19 with 891 views | textbackup |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:00 - Dec 19 by jayessess |
I'm a bit sceptical of the idea that we're going to spend big in January, to be honest.
If you go through our actual first eleven (as opposed to the guys on the fringes), it's hard to see who is easily replaceable at the price points we'd be operating in, especially when you take into account the players we rotate in a lot.
Hladky: Absolutely not
Clarke/Williams Not really, not unless Williams is being sent back for some reason
Davis: No, lol
Woolfenden/Tuanzebe: No
Burgess: Not really, he's playing brilliant and Left-footed Centre Backs are gold dust
Morsy: No, obviously not
Luongo/Taylor: Conceivably, but isn't Taylor is already being queued up here?
Burns/Hutchinson: Burns illustrates his continuing importance week after week, Hutchinson is probably as good as you'd hope for in a teenage loan star
Chaplin: No
Broadhead: No, our main threat when he's on it
Hirst: No, honestly we absolutely lucked out finding one striker at Hirst's level
What would you need to spend to get in players who were significant and obvious upgrades on these guys? Chaplin, Broadhead and Hirst are posting better numbers than players who cost 8-figure fees. Meanwhile we're either having discussions about players from overseas/PL academies/League One with very limited football at this level or talking about moves for players like Szmodics that just aren't going to happen.
And if you're not improving on those 11-14 guys then you're not moving the dial on our promotion chances, not really. Sure, you might breath easier if you have better backup for Morsy or Davis, but anyone you bring in has to be willing to sit behind those two and that affects the quality/experience you can get.
Not saying we'll do no business at all (we'll almost certainly want two forwards, one on a par with Hirst to share his minutes, one nearer to Chaplin/Broadhead to share theirs), just that the window might be, for practical reasons, less ambitious than many imagine. |
KM has shown he’s not afraid to replace a starter.
If there’s someone out there we could get, and he replaces Hirst (for example) we’d be mad not to go for that. |  |
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:27 - Dec 19 with 848 views | jayessess |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:12 - Dec 19 by tractorboy1978 |
Any striker that is on par with Hirst or possibly a slight upgrade is going to cost us a few quid, unless we pull another rabbit out of the hat. I could also see Taylor being nudged forward into a 10 option and us spending a decent sum on a CM. Luongo is doing phenomenally but will be off for a month and is out of contract at the end of the season.
I don't think we will be spending £5m+ on individual players, but could easily see us having a window where we spend £5m-£8m on 2/3 players. |
Striker recruitment looks like a minefield to me. If you're doing it you almost certainly have to sacrifice Ladapo and that's most of your Championship experience walking out the door. You're left with Scarlett (yet to score serious goals at any level), so you can't really recruit another untried youngster or a project.
You can try overseas, but this division is full of strikers from foreign leagues who cost fees of £2m+ and aren't really doing anything.
Think anything you do there is going to have an air of "rabbits being pulled from a hat". [Post edited 19 Dec 2023 9:28]
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:35 - Dec 19 with 815 views | jayessess |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:17 - Dec 19 by textbackup |
KM has shown he’s not afraid to replace a starter.
If there’s someone out there we could get, and he replaces Hirst (for example) we’d be mad not to go for that. |
But I don't think it's a question of whether we'd hypothetically go for a better player in any position, of course we would. It's a question of whether there's any overlap between (a) players who our budget can accommodate and (b) strikers who are definitely better than George Hirst (or any other player in our first XI really).
I suspect that Venn diagram just looks like two entirely distinct non-overlapping circles. [Post edited 19 Dec 2023 9:40]
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:39 - Dec 19 with 779 views | SheffordBlue |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:35 - Dec 19 by jayessess |
But I don't think it's a question of whether we'd hypothetically go for a better player in any position, of course we would. It's a question of whether there's any overlap between (a) players who our budget can accommodate and (b) strikers who are definitely better than George Hirst (or any other player in our first XI really).
I suspect that Venn diagram just looks like two entirely distinct non-overlapping circles. [Post edited 19 Dec 2023 9:40]
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With Hirst I think it's "as good as" rather than "better" (although the latter would obviously be good). He's doing so much heavy lifting with the minutes he's playing and there is a drop off to Freddie/Scarlett etc that any time out for him would be serious.
If we bring in someone at his level then I'd expect to see a bit more rotation in Sat/Tues weeks and for the 'finisher' to be playing 20-30 minutes rather than 5-10. | |
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:42 - Dec 19 with 772 views | itfcsuth |
I don't think roll the dice is correct term.
But, I am sure they will back McKenna in the right areas, with the right players at the right price.
Just as they did in League 1, McKenna & Co got the transfer business spot on in January last year and there is no doubt it helped us step up a gear.
I am sure we will look to do the same - but seems unlikely daft/overpriced money will be thrown about as this has never been the structure of the ownership/management team. |  | | |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:42 - Dec 19 with 771 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:27 - Dec 19 by jayessess |
Striker recruitment looks like a minefield to me. If you're doing it you almost certainly have to sacrifice Ladapo and that's most of your Championship experience walking out the door. You're left with Scarlett (yet to score serious goals at any level), so you can't really recruit another untried youngster or a project.
You can try overseas, but this division is full of strikers from foreign leagues who cost fees of £2m+ and aren't really doing anything.
Think anything you do there is going to have an air of "rabbits being pulled from a hat". [Post edited 19 Dec 2023 9:28]
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That's true although I also expect some of those players would be totally different prospects playing under McKenna and in this team. If McKenna signs a player he seems to know exactly what attributes he wants and coaches/utilises them perfectly.
I have to be honest, I don't think Ladapo has offered a lot at all this season, those two goals against Cardiff aside. He's obviously a great bloke, a popular guy around the place and was excellent for us last season but on the pitch, I don't think we'd be losing a lot if anything if he went.
I'd be very surprised if we signed someone that doesn't either have Championship experience or has scored goals at a decent level abroad. | | | |
| POST OF THE DAY on 09:48 - Dec 19 with 745 views | NthQldITFC |
| POST OF THE DAY on 06:56 - Dec 19 by ElephantintheRoom |
Ahem. The franchise is. NOT way ahead of its timeline. It was one year behind the spreadsheet (and minus £12 million) getting out of a Covid-destroyed third division and (assuming promotion) is one year ahead of the spreadsheet in the second division… at the cost of another minus £12 million… the reality is that the carpetbaggers are on track for where they were told they would be ‘on the project plan’ - but are somewhat out of pocket.
Given that the pleasing level of success this season is largely down to NOT making any significant signings and going again with the successful blend they already had it kind of suggests it would be madness to add in yet more signings.
Interesting that most infantile fantasies seem to be a striker to sort out the top scoring side in the division, which would mean a poke in the eye for Hirst who has been a Town player for about 6 months and is almost certainly the biggest earner. |
Saw your post before I logged in. Best one yet.  Can't quite see what you get out of it, sport, but each to his own.
Back on the list now. |  |
| # WE ARE STEALING THE FUTURE FROM OUR CHILDREN --- WE MUST CHANGE COURSE # | | Poll: | It's driving me nuts |
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| POST OF THE DAY on 09:50 - Dec 19 with 739 views | MattinLondon |
| POST OF THE DAY on 08:01 - Dec 19 by redrickstuhaart |
Surely time that this tedious troll vanished? |
Im not proud to say this but he’s now the only poster on my ignore list. If everyone does that, he’ll basically be arguing with himself - which is what he probably does in his old folks home. [Post edited 19 Dec 2023 9:57]
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:52 - Dec 19 with 723 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:35 - Dec 19 by jayessess |
But I don't think it's a question of whether we'd hypothetically go for a better player in any position, of course we would. It's a question of whether there's any overlap between (a) players who our budget can accommodate and (b) strikers who are definitely better than George Hirst (or any other player in our first XI really).
I suspect that Venn diagram just looks like two entirely distinct non-overlapping circles. [Post edited 19 Dec 2023 9:40]
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Re our budget - I do think you have to apply the context of us being somewhere in the region of 7-13 points clear of 3rd place by the 1st Jan too. Realistically we will never go into a mid season window with such a fantastic opportunity to get promoted. Imagine Hirst picking up an injury in March that keeps him out for a month, we drop a few points and miss out. I can't see us taking that risk personally and I think we will really push ourselves to land the right player. | | | |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:54 - Dec 19 with 699 views | jayessess |
| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 09:39 - Dec 19 by SheffordBlue |
With Hirst I think it's "as good as" rather than "better" (although the latter would obviously be good). He's doing so much heavy lifting with the minutes he's playing and there is a drop off to Freddie/Scarlett etc that any time out for him would be serious.
If we bring in someone at his level then I'd expect to see a bit more rotation in Sat/Tues weeks and for the 'finisher' to be playing 20-30 minutes rather than 5-10. |
For sure, I think that's what we'll try to do. Going to be really tough though, everyone's looking for Hirst's profile of striker.
Do you recruit from a lower division (ie. Colby Bishop or someone even more projecty like Ali Al Hamadi)?
Do you go overseas and risk recruiting someone akin to the half dozen mostly useless lumps from foreign leagues we've seen this season (Haji Wright/Luis Semedo/Ryan Mmaee/Emmanuel Latte Lath/Milutin Osmajic etc.)?
Do you hope there's a fringe player at a Premier League club that'll do the job (hopefully someone a bit older than Dane Scarlett, like Rodrigo Muniz)?
Or try to get imaginative with players at other Championship clubs (could Jay Stansfield be poached from dysfunctional Birmingham? Or could we get someone like Chris Willock who could cover Chaplin too and has 6 months left on his contract)?
Don't see it being straightforward. | |
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| Do you think Ashton and the US owners are going to roll the dice in January?? on 10:02 - Dec 19 with 659 views | oldbeardy |
Imagine looking back on this point in a couple of years if we didn't invest significantly and then missed out - we could lose McK and might not be in this position with such a strong chance for promotion for ages. Its very difficult to 'consolidate' because nothing stands still around you - look at the drop off for some of the clubs that challenged last year. So we surely have to go for it while everything's in our favour | | | |
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