| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' 14:43 - Oct 26 with 3599 views | Mookamoo |
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-63401193
Compromise what exactly? Qatari homophobia? LGBT fans very right to exist?
I for one will not be watching one minute of this World Cup. Absolute farce. |  | | |  |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 14:55 - Oct 26 with 2771 views | itfcjoe |
Well it's fairly obvious what they need to do, or not do isn't it?
I was in Dubai for Ramadan one year, my wife had to cover up if we left the hotel, we weren't allowed to eat or drink in public, no public displays of affection.
We had to compromise, minor compromises in reality compared to what LGBT people will have to do but if they choose to visit a place with backwards rules then they have to ensure that they don't do things that will potentially draw unwanted attention to themselves |  |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 14:59 - Oct 26 with 2756 views | LeoMuff |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 14:55 - Oct 26 by itfcjoe |
Well it's fairly obvious what they need to do, or not do isn't it?
I was in Dubai for Ramadan one year, my wife had to cover up if we left the hotel, we weren't allowed to eat or drink in public, no public displays of affection.
We had to compromise, minor compromises in reality compared to what LGBT people will have to do but if they choose to visit a place with backwards rules then they have to ensure that they don't do things that will potentially draw unwanted attention to themselves |
Well they should be expected to compromise their very existence of course, FIFA have a cash cow that needs milking. |  |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:05 - Oct 26 with 2738 views | J2BLUE |
No love for the Tories at all but this is probably as much about protecting the people as anything. Last thing anyone needs is to find themselves in a Qatari jail over something like this. Yes, Qatar should never have been awarded the tournament but they have and it's happening so it probably needed to be said.
Certain countries around the world do not live up to our liberal ideals. That is unfortunate but fact. |  |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:06 - Oct 26 with 2728 views | itfcjoe |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 14:59 - Oct 26 by LeoMuff |
Well they should be expected to compromise their very existence of course, FIFA have a cash cow that needs milking. |
If they are allowed to share a hotel room and are not being monitored behind closed doors, then what is the difference between 2 gay people being there opposed to 2 same sex friends, or a mixed sex couple who aren't allowed public displays of affection?
There are a whole host of issues why this WC shouldn't be in Qatar, and I'd include their homophobic laws near the top of those reasons - but people aren't going into this with their eyes closed and James Cleverly offering some sensible and obvious advice is hardly an issue | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:09 - Oct 26 with 2706 views | RobTheMonk |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:06 - Oct 26 by itfcjoe |
If they are allowed to share a hotel room and are not being monitored behind closed doors, then what is the difference between 2 gay people being there opposed to 2 same sex friends, or a mixed sex couple who aren't allowed public displays of affection?
There are a whole host of issues why this WC shouldn't be in Qatar, and I'd include their homophobic laws near the top of those reasons - but people aren't going into this with their eyes closed and James Cleverly offering some sensible and obvious advice is hardly an issue |
Genuine question, but you quite often see players hugging and bro-kissing when scoring... Will teams be warned beforehand to watch their celebrations?
It's all a bit mental. |  | | |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:12 - Oct 26 with 2689 views | itfcjoe |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:09 - Oct 26 by RobTheMonk |
Genuine question, but you quite often see players hugging and bro-kissing when scoring... Will teams be warned beforehand to watch their celebrations?
It's all a bit mental. |
Maybe they will draft in the Morality Police from Iran to come and monitor celebrations......
I shouldn't joke, it's a very serious issue, but is mental how it is there in the middle of the season - in fairness to Sepp Blatter it would have been the last thing he wanted but the genie was well and truly out of the bottle | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:14 - Oct 26 with 2665 views | jayessess |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:05 - Oct 26 by J2BLUE |
No love for the Tories at all but this is probably as much about protecting the people as anything. Last thing anyone needs is to find themselves in a Qatari jail over something like this. Yes, Qatar should never have been awarded the tournament but they have and it's happening so it probably needed to be said.
Certain countries around the world do not live up to our liberal ideals. That is unfortunate but fact. |
There is a question of tone though, isn't there?
The Foreign Office issuing a warning about certain realities is very different from the Foreign Secretary telling people they should "respect the (homophobic) culture of your host nation". |  |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:15 - Oct 26 with 2653 views | Mookamoo |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 14:55 - Oct 26 by itfcjoe |
Well it's fairly obvious what they need to do, or not do isn't it?
I was in Dubai for Ramadan one year, my wife had to cover up if we left the hotel, we weren't allowed to eat or drink in public, no public displays of affection.
We had to compromise, minor compromises in reality compared to what LGBT people will have to do but if they choose to visit a place with backwards rules then they have to ensure that they don't do things that will potentially draw unwanted attention to themselves |
One wrong (albeit honest) answer to a simple question from an over zealous official could end up with the death penalty. Not exactly the same is it. | | | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:20 - Oct 26 with 2615 views | J2BLUE |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:14 - Oct 26 by jayessess |
There is a question of tone though, isn't there?
The Foreign Office issuing a warning about certain realities is very different from the Foreign Secretary telling people they should "respect the (homophobic) culture of your host nation". |
Well they need to don't they?
I don't want to get into the rights and wrongs of it because it's clearly wrong but factually, they do need to don't they? | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:30 - Oct 26 with 2565 views | jayessess |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:20 - Oct 26 by J2BLUE |
Well they need to don't they?
I don't want to get into the rights and wrongs of it because it's clearly wrong but factually, they do need to don't they? |
Factually, people who go to Qatar will need to obey the local laws and adapt their behaviour to remain safe. No-one needs to or should "respect" homophobia.
As an official of the British Government you can frame that as objective advice in a lamentable situation that you disapprove of or you can frame it as "being respectful to local custom" so as not to disrupt your economic and political interests in the region. Cleverley's doing the latter. | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:34 - Oct 26 with 2538 views | J2BLUE |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:30 - Oct 26 by jayessess |
Factually, people who go to Qatar will need to obey the local laws and adapt their behaviour to remain safe. No-one needs to or should "respect" homophobia.
As an official of the British Government you can frame that as objective advice in a lamentable situation that you disapprove of or you can frame it as "being respectful to local custom" so as not to disrupt your economic and political interests in the region. Cleverley's doing the latter. |
Figure of speech. I'm sure he does not respect their laws. I'm sure you can see the general point being made and agree that while unfortunate, it is factually accurate. | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:37 - Oct 26 with 2511 views | lowhouseblue |
stupid decision to hold the world cup in such a backward place. this is just a consequence of that decision. advise on how not to get in trouble with the law there is sensible - very sad that fifa has made it necessary. |  |
| And so as the loose-bowelled pigeon of time swoops low over the unsuspecting tourist of destiny, and the flatulent skunk of fate wanders into the air-conditioning system of eternity, I notice it's the end of the show |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:38 - Oct 26 with 2480 views | Swansea_Blue |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:05 - Oct 26 by J2BLUE |
No love for the Tories at all but this is probably as much about protecting the people as anything. Last thing anyone needs is to find themselves in a Qatari jail over something like this. Yes, Qatar should never have been awarded the tournament but they have and it's happening so it probably needed to be said.
Certain countries around the world do not live up to our liberal ideals. That is unfortunate but fact. |
It should be about warning people to protect themselves, but it's not couched in that way at all. I suspect Cleverley's words will land like a bucket of sick with the LGBT community. |  |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:46 - Oct 26 with 2398 views | jayessess |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:34 - Oct 26 by J2BLUE |
Figure of speech. I'm sure he does not respect their laws. I'm sure you can see the general point being made and agree that while unfortunate, it is factually accurate. |
What I'm saying is that the "figure of speech" chosen is bad. | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:47 - Oct 26 with 2388 views | jeera |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:37 - Oct 26 by lowhouseblue |
stupid decision to hold the world cup in such a backward place. this is just a consequence of that decision. advise on how not to get in trouble with the law there is sensible - very sad that fifa has made it necessary. |
Incredible there wasn't far more pushing back when it was even considered as an option.
The world is going backwards. |  |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:48 - Oct 26 with 2371 views | Mookamoo |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:30 - Oct 26 by jayessess |
Factually, people who go to Qatar will need to obey the local laws and adapt their behaviour to remain safe. No-one needs to or should "respect" homophobia.
As an official of the British Government you can frame that as objective advice in a lamentable situation that you disapprove of or you can frame it as "being respectful to local custom" so as not to disrupt your economic and political interests in the region. Cleverley's doing the latter. |
Cleverly just had a call from someone in Qatar about Peter Tatchell and they want him to nip any dissent in the bud.
He could have prefaced any statement with a comment about supporting our LGBT fans and criticising Qatar's stance but chose not do. Its all about the money and I for one will not be complicit. | | | |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:48 - Oct 26 with 2358 views | J2BLUE |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:47 - Oct 26 by jeera |
Incredible there wasn't far more pushing back when it was even considered as an option.
The world is going backwards. |
It is.
Let's hope Trump doesn't come back to create a similar situation in the US in 2026. | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:53 - Oct 26 with 2297 views | itfcjoe |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:15 - Oct 26 by Mookamoo |
One wrong (albeit honest) answer to a simple question from an over zealous official could end up with the death penalty. Not exactly the same is it. |
No tourist is going to get the death penalty for answering a question wrongly | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:59 - Oct 26 with 2153 views | chicoazul |
“These are Muslim countries, they have very different cultural starting point for us.“
Many people here said more or less the same in my thread about Morsy not wearing the rainbow armband, if indeed that is why he didn’t. |  |
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| 11/4 fav currently. (n/t) on 16:02 - Oct 26 with 2115 views | Bloots |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:48 - Oct 26 by J2BLUE |
It is.
Let's hope Trump doesn't come back to create a similar situation in the US in 2026. |
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| Elite Level Poster: Elite Level Supporter: Elite Level Human |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 16:05 - Oct 26 with 2106 views | jeera |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:59 - Oct 26 by chicoazul |
“These are Muslim countries, they have very different cultural starting point for us.“
Many people here said more or less the same in my thread about Morsy not wearing the rainbow armband, if indeed that is why he didn’t. |
It is different in as much Morsy hasn't persecuted anyone.
I actually took your point although kept out of it because you could have worded things differently and I could see why some posters felt you were baiting.
You do like to stick an edge on things which occasionally works but usually gives people the needle.
If you could find a way to express these things without trying to wind everyone up you might have more joy! | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 16:09 - Oct 26 with 2064 views | chicoazul |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 16:05 - Oct 26 by jeera |
It is different in as much Morsy hasn't persecuted anyone.
I actually took your point although kept out of it because you could have worded things differently and I could see why some posters felt you were baiting.
You do like to stick an edge on things which occasionally works but usually gives people the needle.
If you could find a way to express these things without trying to wind everyone up you might have more joy! |
But my point to those attacking me over that was, we don’t *know* why he didn’t wear one. Many people were saying he didn’t persecute anyone or attack anyone or whatever. That’s fine, they take that in faith as he seems like a good bloke and I agree he does. But until we know why he didn’t wear one it’s not fair to ascribe any purpose to his action. Was it an error of omission? Was it deliberately done? I think we should know. I appreciate many people don’t care and that’s fine too. Did our captain last night wear one?
Edit; I do appreciate your point though. In general I think I make it clear when I’m joking. I’m never trolling which is a different thing. [Post edited 26 Oct 2022 16:11]
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 16:11 - Oct 26 with 2046 views | jeera |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 16:09 - Oct 26 by chicoazul |
But my point to those attacking me over that was, we don’t *know* why he didn’t wear one. Many people were saying he didn’t persecute anyone or attack anyone or whatever. That’s fine, they take that in faith as he seems like a good bloke and I agree he does. But until we know why he didn’t wear one it’s not fair to ascribe any purpose to his action. Was it an error of omission? Was it deliberately done? I think we should know. I appreciate many people don’t care and that’s fine too. Did our captain last night wear one?
Edit; I do appreciate your point though. In general I think I make it clear when I’m joking. I’m never trolling which is a different thing. [Post edited 26 Oct 2022 16:11]
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Dunno, my head hurts.
That was my attempt to be understanding and it's enough for one day. | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 16:13 - Oct 26 with 1998 views | J2BLUE |
| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 15:59 - Oct 26 by chicoazul |
“These are Muslim countries, they have very different cultural starting point for us.“
Many people here said more or less the same in my thread about Morsy not wearing the rainbow armband, if indeed that is why he didn’t. |
I was consistent on both threads. | |
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| LGBT Fans have to show respect and 'compromise' on 16:32 - Oct 26 with 1911 views | Stewart27 |
I get where you’re coming from.
The fact that they’ve chosen to hold the World Cup in a homophobic country is another on the long list of reasons not to hold it there.
However, this is just sensible advice. Why would you even bother going there if you are part of the LGBT community? Stay at home and enjoy it in a country where you’re accepted. I wouldn’t go there because of the anti drinking culture. |  | | |
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