| No deal Brexit 08:51 - Aug 11 with 15446 views | Herbivore |
In recent days there have been a number of stories coming out about a no deal Brexit.
We’ve had Matt Hancock — now fervent no deal backer — refusing to rule out that a no deal Brexit could lead to deaths of patients due to medication shortages. He has spoken about millions of pounds being spent on trying to prevent this whilst describing no deal as “not pretty”. (Source — The Evening Standard)
We’ve had Christopher Hope, another ardent Brexiteer, explaining how we can airlift in essentials like food and medication in the event of a no deal Brexit. That’s right, the 5th largest economy in the world can airlift in humanitarian aid for itself in the event of a no deal Brexit. The cabinet are also reported to have accepted that food prices will increase post-Brexit and this will have an impact for at least a decade. (Source — The Telegraph)
We’ve had a government leak telling us that we cannot maintain the integrity of our waters in the event of a no deal Brexit. (Source — The BBC)
We’ve had the treasury telling us that they will be setting up a “bail out fund” to prevent businesses from going bust in the event of a no deal Brexit. That’s millions if not billions of pounds of public money that is going to be used to prop up businesses that would otherwise fail because of a no deal Brexit. (Source — Various news outlets)
Now, these aren’t ‘project fear’ scare stories from ‘Remoaners’. These are coming from those who either support Brexit, are charged with preparing for no deal Brexit, or most often both. Nobody — aside from perhaps Boris — is even trying to pretend anymore that a no deal Brexit will lead us to the ‘sunlit uplands’. They are open about the fact that it will harm businesses and the economy and that it will lead to shortages of food and medication. It will make things more expensive for the public. We risk inflation going through the roof. On top of that we also know:
A no deal Brexit poses an existential threat to the United Kingdom. In the event of no deal, Scotland will agitate to leave the UK and it seems more likely than not that they will leave. Northern Ireland will be plunged into deep uncertainty.
No deal Brexit also puts us back to square one in negotiating future trade with the EU, but it puts us in a position of weakness in doing so because (a) we will be desperate for a deal, and (b) negotiations will likely take place in an atmosphere of mistrust and bad faith given how the government has conducted itself over Brexit thus far.
Furthermore, the US has ruled out a trade deal with the UK being ratified if the UK does anything to jeopardise the Good Friday Agreement. A no deal Brexit, which will necessitate border checks on the island of Ireland, will necessarily act as a threat to the Good Friday Agreement and that scuppers us doing a trade deal with the US.
Other major countries will be reluctant to do trade deals with us for two reasons. Firstly, we’ve already said we intend to offer tariff-free access for 90%+ of goods and services following a no deal Brexit, so there is no incentive to do a free trade deal with us. Secondly, any major economy will want to know what our trading relationship with the EU will look like before committing to a deal. They will want to know how easily a deal with us will improve or hinder access to our biggest trading partner in the EU.
We also know that Brexit has cost and will continue to cost billions in terms of money spent to mitigate its impact and in terms of the ongoing hit on the economy.
I know that there are some on here who are very keen on a no deal Brexit and see this as their preferred option. Given all of the above I am genuinely curious as to what the rational basis is for your support of a no deal Brexit. What do you see as the short- and long-term benefits that will outweigh all of the above? Do you feel that potential deaths, food and medication shortages, the break up of the UK, the economy struggling, things becoming more expensive, billions being spent on avoiding disaster rather than making the country better etc. is a price worth paying to leave the EU at all costs? If so, how do you justify that?
[Post edited 11 Aug 2019 9:10]
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| No deal Brexit on 22:44 - Aug 22 with 591 views | Herbivore |
| No deal Brexit on 22:37 - Aug 22 by Eireannach_gorm |
Yet you counter his argument with your opinion. |
He's mainly countered with condescension, despite him having clearly not properly read and digested the OP. | |
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| No deal Brexit on 22:46 - Aug 22 with 578 views | xrayspecs |
| No deal Brexit on 22:37 - Aug 22 by Eireannach_gorm |
Yet you counter his argument with your opinion. |
Clearly my opinion.
And??? |  | | |
| No deal Brexit on 22:50 - Aug 22 with 562 views | xrayspecs |
| No deal Brexit on 22:42 - Aug 22 by Herbivore |
You've been terribly condescending, so perhaps you might want to reflect on that. I'm just giving you a bit back.
Re-read the OP. There are plenty of examples of actual evidence in there, in particular there are examples cited of government spending on no deal preparations and government reports on the expected impact of a no deal Brexit and the capacity of government departments to deal with the impact. |
More abuse.
You continue to present opinions as fact and fail to recognise that many of these would be any more than short term disruption.
I am not a no-deal supporter. | | | |
| No deal Brexit on 22:52 - Aug 22 with 559 views | Herbivore |
| No deal Brexit on 22:50 - Aug 22 by xrayspecs |
More abuse.
You continue to present opinions as fact and fail to recognise that many of these would be any more than short term disruption.
I am not a no-deal supporter. |
You're just trolling me now. | |
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| No deal Brexit on 22:53 - Aug 22 with 555 views | xrayspecs |
| No deal Brexit on 22:52 - Aug 22 by Herbivore |
You're just trolling me now. |
No.
I am challenging you to debate this topic. | | | |
| No deal Brexit on 23:00 - Aug 22 with 543 views | Herbivore |
| No deal Brexit on 22:53 - Aug 22 by xrayspecs |
No.
I am challenging you to debate this topic. |
You really aren't. There is lots of evidence in the OP, but you seem to think that, for example, the government reporting that they are spending millions on no deal prep is the recycled opinion of a Remainer rather than evidence of no deal having a negative impact. I'm not sure where to begin with that other than to assume you're trolling. Well done, you got a bite. | |
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| No deal Brexit on 23:17 - Aug 22 with 530 views | xrayspecs |
| No deal Brexit on 23:00 - Aug 22 by Herbivore |
You really aren't. There is lots of evidence in the OP, but you seem to think that, for example, the government reporting that they are spending millions on no deal prep is the recycled opinion of a Remainer rather than evidence of no deal having a negative impact. I'm not sure where to begin with that other than to assume you're trolling. Well done, you got a bite. |
It is widely known that govt (and companies) have spent a lot on Brexit planning. Of course they would...I mentioned this earlier too, so not sure what point you are trying to make.
I have addressed the point about medicines supply - something I know a lot about. It is under control so not a scare story.
We already import a lot of food from outside the EU via air, so no change there. Perishables from EU via the ports are a challenge. But most of what we eat is not EU perishables. So we will be fine. Some UK export markets eg Welsh lamb will stay in the uk, no problem there unless prices collapse. UK govt has said it is prepared to step in and support as it has done on the past.
So lots of challenges, but most will be manageable. | | | |
| No deal Brexit on 06:22 - Aug 23 with 464 views | Herbivore |
| No deal Brexit on 23:17 - Aug 22 by xrayspecs |
It is widely known that govt (and companies) have spent a lot on Brexit planning. Of course they would...I mentioned this earlier too, so not sure what point you are trying to make.
I have addressed the point about medicines supply - something I know a lot about. It is under control so not a scare story.
We already import a lot of food from outside the EU via air, so no change there. Perishables from EU via the ports are a challenge. But most of what we eat is not EU perishables. So we will be fine. Some UK export markets eg Welsh lamb will stay in the uk, no problem there unless prices collapse. UK govt has said it is prepared to step in and support as it has done on the past.
So lots of challenges, but most will be manageable. |
That's just opinion. | |
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| No deal Brexit on 07:11 - Aug 23 with 449 views | No9 |
| No deal Brexit on 23:17 - Aug 22 by xrayspecs |
It is widely known that govt (and companies) have spent a lot on Brexit planning. Of course they would...I mentioned this earlier too, so not sure what point you are trying to make.
I have addressed the point about medicines supply - something I know a lot about. It is under control so not a scare story.
We already import a lot of food from outside the EU via air, so no change there. Perishables from EU via the ports are a challenge. But most of what we eat is not EU perishables. So we will be fine. Some UK export markets eg Welsh lamb will stay in the uk, no problem there unless prices collapse. UK govt has said it is prepared to step in and support as it has done on the past.
So lots of challenges, but most will be manageable. |
"We already import a lot of food from outside the EU via air, so no change there."
It isn't true there will be no change, if the UK leaves the EU with no agreement in place the WTO ageements the UK has with circa 80 other countries as a member of the WTO via the EU will cease immediately.
Any arrangements the YK makes will either be outside the WTO rules or subject to the full range of tariffs.
The President of the WTO said in a radio interview that the WTO members, who make the rules will require full customs checks on the border between the 2 Irelands.
Many WTO members are objecting to the UK becoming an independent member with 'Favoured Nation' status.
It is nowhere as easy as the new administration is making out. | | | |
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