| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... 09:42 - Mar 2 with 5552 views | unstableblue |
...she's a right wing loon
With an entrenched anti-lockdown stance
(Don't get me wrong the cost/risk/benefit trade off for Lock-Down was probably well off the mark, but the government had to be risk averse at the time, you'd want them to be)
Amazed how many sensible people and wider media are getting sucked into here point of view.
Disappointed a little in Newsnight last night - an Oakeshott colleague was using the Hancock whatsapp to promote the Telegraph narrative, and a well informed scientist was painting the true picture of the time, calling out some of the statements, and I'm not sure she was given enough space to get the counter view across. |  |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 07:37 - Mar 3 with 1154 views | tractordownsouth |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 10:35 - Mar 2 by EastTownBlue |
Which makes Hancock a bigger fool than we already thought. |
It was especially stupid for him to trust her when you consider that Oakeshott’s partner leads a rival political party which is popular among the anti-vax crowd and are aiming to take votes off the Tories. |  |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 07:43 - Mar 3 with 1137 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 07:33 - Mar 3 by Herbivore |
How many people were fined £6400 for sitting on a bench for five minutes? |
More to the point how many of those issued with a fixed fine were taken to court for not paying. Very few I would think and suspect the majority were never paid. |  |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 07:57 - Mar 3 with 1114 views | StokieBlue |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 07:33 - Mar 3 by Herbivore |
How many people were fined £6400 for sitting on a bench for five minutes? |
He's simply proving my point about people trying to rewrite what actually happened during the pandemic in favour of whatever fits their current narrative about the pandemic.
SB |  |
| Avatar - M51 - The Whirlpool Galaxy - Taken on 29th April 2024 |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:09 - Mar 3 with 1087 views | mr_bean |
I really enjoyed seeing Jacqui Smith telling Oakeshott to "shut up" on Politics Live the other day. |  | | |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:18 - Mar 3 with 1079 views | Herbivore |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 07:36 - Mar 3 by DanTheMan |
This is a fun game. We'll get down to a fine of a packet of biscuits for 30 seconds on a bench. |
Until ultimately we reach a point where we realise that people weren't getting massive fines for sitting down for 5 minutes. Police told people to go home if they felt they might be breaching the rules, fines were only issued where people refused or where breaches were egregious. |  |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:24 - Mar 3 with 1074 views | itfcjoe |
It's a load of rubbish - she's always been a lockdown sceptic and was wrong about so much - and if she had any integrity she'd have leaked them to a newspaper that isn't one who has been oushing anti-lockdown stuff almost from the start so that they would be looked at through a more neutral eye.
The Telegraph is a joke these days, Oakshott has been a joke for years and Matt Hancock a w*nker who made a deal with the devil just to try and make himself look good. |  |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:30 - Mar 3 with 1068 views | Herbivore |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:24 - Mar 3 by itfcjoe |
It's a load of rubbish - she's always been a lockdown sceptic and was wrong about so much - and if she had any integrity she'd have leaked them to a newspaper that isn't one who has been oushing anti-lockdown stuff almost from the start so that they would be looked at through a more neutral eye.
The Telegraph is a joke these days, Oakshott has been a joke for years and Matt Hancock a w*nker who made a deal with the devil just to try and make himself look good. |
Indeed, if her main concern was the public interest then the Telegraph is an odd choice. It's increasingly not trusted as a serious news source given its lurched towards being a propaganda sheet. It's not the most widely read news source and it sits behind a paywall. If her concern was public interest, give the messages to a more credible and accessible source. | |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:47 - Mar 3 with 1045 views | Vaughan8 |
Just saw her interview on GMB earlier and she clearly.loves the attention and thinks she's the greatest for releasing these WhatsApp messages.
Don't get me wrong, I don't like Hancock and he has done wrong things but I think this has pretty much ruined her career. Who is gonna trust her with information now? | | | |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:51 - Mar 3 with 1035 views | SuperKieranMcKenna |
Choosing between Oakeshott and Hancock really is the epitome of a Keane v Hurst moment. | | | |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:52 - Mar 3 with 1032 views | MattinLondon |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:47 - Mar 3 by Vaughan8 |
Just saw her interview on GMB earlier and she clearly.loves the attention and thinks she's the greatest for releasing these WhatsApp messages.
Don't get me wrong, I don't like Hancock and he has done wrong things but I think this has pretty much ruined her career. Who is gonna trust her with information now? |
And that will allow her to play the ‘victim’ card for a long time. Interesting how it’s the tell-it-like-it-is mob who whine the loudest when things go wrong for them. |  | | |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:53 - Mar 3 with 1027 views | Swansea_Blue |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:24 - Mar 3 by itfcjoe |
It's a load of rubbish - she's always been a lockdown sceptic and was wrong about so much - and if she had any integrity she'd have leaked them to a newspaper that isn't one who has been oushing anti-lockdown stuff almost from the start so that they would be looked at through a more neutral eye.
The Telegraph is a joke these days, Oakshott has been a joke for years and Matt Hancock a w*nker who made a deal with the devil just to try and make himself look good. |
That seems to sum it all up nicely. |  |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:54 - Mar 3 with 1025 views | itfcjoe |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 07:37 - Mar 3 by tractordownsouth |
It was especially stupid for him to trust her when you consider that Oakeshott’s partner leads a rival political party which is popular among the anti-vax crowd and are aiming to take votes off the Tories. |
Especially when you see all the details of Fox News court case going through US Courts - where the presenters know they are lying and admit as such but have to say what their base wants to hear.
It's why the vaccinated Trump had to stop talking about vaccines, because his supporters were anti them and they'd drop them.
It's why conspiracy theorists have to believe in every conspiracy theory - because as soon as you show you have any semblance of rationality you are kicked out of the group (and your YouTube funding disappears) | |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:05 - Mar 3 with 1012 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:18 - Mar 3 by Herbivore |
Until ultimately we reach a point where we realise that people weren't getting massive fines for sitting down for 5 minutes. Police told people to go home if they felt they might be breaching the rules, fines were only issued where people refused or where breaches were egregious. |
Regardless of fines do you feel there was any state over reach in any of the rules that they imposed? |  |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:12 - Mar 3 with 977 views | StokieBlue |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:05 - Mar 3 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Regardless of fines do you feel there was any state over reach in any of the rules that they imposed? |
In the context of the time, the rules were sensible and actually less restrictive than many other countries. For instance, in France you could only go to the shop/outside with a code provided once a day I believe.
It's important to remember context, in March 2020 they didn't even really know how covid was spread and they were actually pretty wrong at the time with regards to the main vectors.
Given this, being more restrictive than less was perfectly understandable.
SB | |
| Avatar - M51 - The Whirlpool Galaxy - Taken on 29th April 2024 |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:21 - Mar 3 with 963 views | Herbivore |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:05 - Mar 3 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Regardless of fines do you feel there was any state over reach in any of the rules that they imposed? |
Not especially, given the context we were in at the time. | |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:24 - Mar 3 with 959 views | ElderGrizzly |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 08:47 - Mar 3 by Vaughan8 |
Just saw her interview on GMB earlier and she clearly.loves the attention and thinks she's the greatest for releasing these WhatsApp messages.
Don't get me wrong, I don't like Hancock and he has done wrong things but I think this has pretty much ruined her career. Who is gonna trust her with information now? |
If you look at her history of leaking information or lying for a story, Hancock was stupid to go anywhere near her.
Yet his vanity and arrogance to get a book out, maybe she was the only one equally who would go near him.
A summary of her 'career' here
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/mar/01/isabel-oakeshott-the-journalist |  | | |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:26 - Mar 3 with 954 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:12 - Mar 3 by StokieBlue |
In the context of the time, the rules were sensible and actually less restrictive than many other countries. For instance, in France you could only go to the shop/outside with a code provided once a day I believe.
It's important to remember context, in March 2020 they didn't even really know how covid was spread and they were actually pretty wrong at the time with regards to the main vectors.
Given this, being more restrictive than less was perfectly understandable.
SB |
I remember the context and being less restrictive than a more restrictive place does not validate it.
I remember well the stick some people on here got for daring to suggest that being outside in a public space for more than an hour, while maintaining a sensible distance from others, was more than likely not an issue and considering mental health concerns a risk worth taking. Kids imho should have been able to mix outside in parks, beaches etc but not in school too for the same reason.
Oakenshott, or whatever her name is, is definitely not the one to be claiming any moral higher ground here though. | |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:31 - Mar 3 with 947 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:21 - Mar 3 by Herbivore |
Not especially, given the context we were in at the time. |
I disagree, it was Spring and for example care home residents would likely have been safer outside in gardens rather than restricted to rooms indoors with staff rotating between them. Family visits outdoors too for that matter. | |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:42 - Mar 3 with 935 views | DJR |
If you look at the terms of reference of the UK Covid Inquiry, they appear to be wide enough to cover the things that Oakeshott and her ilk are concerned about.
https://covid19.public-inquiry.uk/terms-of-reference/
The impression I get though is that they fear their side of the argument will be downplayed in the course of the inquiry because, for example, the bereaved will be thought to be a more deserving case. As a result, it seems to be a case of setting the narrative by leaking their side of the story in advance of the inquiry starting to take evidence.
The thing is that some of the issues with which they are concerned should be looked at so that we can learn lessons for the future, but the fact is that it was an unknown disease which means things were not as black and white as they suggest at the time, particularly given the competing interests. [Post edited 3 Mar 2023 9:44]
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:43 - Mar 3 with 932 views | Herbivore |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:31 - Mar 3 by BanksterDebtSlave |
I disagree, it was Spring and for example care home residents would likely have been safer outside in gardens rather than restricted to rooms indoors with staff rotating between them. Family visits outdoors too for that matter. |
I think there's a fair bit of hindsight there, given they didn't really know how it was transmitting at that point, but this debate has been done to death already. For me the biggest mistakes the government made around the first lockdown were not locking down earlier, poor messaging in those early weeks, and not testing people going into care homes. | |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:50 - Mar 3 with 910 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:43 - Mar 3 by Herbivore |
I think there's a fair bit of hindsight there, given they didn't really know how it was transmitting at that point, but this debate has been done to death already. For me the biggest mistakes the government made around the first lockdown were not locking down earlier, poor messaging in those early weeks, and not testing people going into care homes. |
Hindsight or old fashioned common sense and yes some measures needed introducing earlier. | |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 10:26 - Mar 3 with 859 views | Herbivore |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:50 - Mar 3 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Hindsight or old fashioned common sense and yes some measures needed introducing earlier. |
I'd prefer to take scientific opinion over common sense when it comes to a pandemic, to be honest. | |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 11:02 - Mar 3 with 802 views | StokieBlue |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 09:26 - Mar 3 by BanksterDebtSlave |
I remember the context and being less restrictive than a more restrictive place does not validate it.
I remember well the stick some people on here got for daring to suggest that being outside in a public space for more than an hour, while maintaining a sensible distance from others, was more than likely not an issue and considering mental health concerns a risk worth taking. Kids imho should have been able to mix outside in parks, beaches etc but not in school too for the same reason.
Oakenshott, or whatever her name is, is definitely not the one to be claiming any moral higher ground here though. |
All of those opinions were based on no evidence though because the scientific community didn't have the answers at the time.
So what you've done is move the modern context with modern information back onto the situation at the time and used it to justify opinions at the time which weren't based on science.
SB | |
| Avatar - M51 - The Whirlpool Galaxy - Taken on 29th April 2024 |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 13:28 - Mar 3 with 705 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 11:02 - Mar 3 by StokieBlue |
All of those opinions were based on no evidence though because the scientific community didn't have the answers at the time.
So what you've done is move the modern context with modern information back onto the situation at the time and used it to justify opinions at the time which weren't based on science.
SB |
In that case science did not support any of the options at the beginning. | |
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| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 13:37 - Mar 3 with 685 views | StokieBlue |
| Don't get sucked into the Isabel Oakeshott narrative... on 13:28 - Mar 3 by BanksterDebtSlave |
In that case science did not support any of the options at the beginning. |
Not true, the scientists had theories and advised with those ideas and a very cautious approach. Anything else would have been hugely irresponsible. By your logic they should have advised that the government let the virus run amok and kill thousands more people until they fully understood it.
I started responding to you as I felt you had stopped being strange with regards to covid but I see that's not actually the case.
It's disappointing.
SB | |
| Avatar - M51 - The Whirlpool Galaxy - Taken on 29th April 2024 |
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