| 11th, 9th & 11th 23:09 - Feb 11 with 9275 views | GlasgowBlue |
That’s our League one finishing position for the last three seasons. Money doesn’t give us the God given right to a top 2 finish just one season later.
Look at the money Sunderland spent. It took them four or five seasons to get out of this division. And going into March last year they looked like the team who were going to drop outside of the play off places.
If we finish 6th then that’s progress. If we finish in the top two, and that is still a real possibility, then it will be a fantastic achievement.
As for today’s result; so many of our draws have felt like defeats. This draw feels like a win. And psychologically could give the players a real boost.
Let’s cut out the defeatist talk, the sense of entitlement and the over the top criticism of Kieran McKenna. Along with the owners and Mark Ashton, he has given us our most exciting and entertaining season in years.
Let’s get behind the club, the players and the manager.
COYB!!! [Post edited 11 Feb 2023 23:12]
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:39 - Feb 12 with 1201 views | Pique |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:12 - Feb 12 by TractorWood |
How so? We still start the next season in the same league. A bit of participation mindset creeping into what is frankly a dismal league. |
Because we'll have gone from being the 11th best team in the league to being the 3rd best team. That's not a participant mindset, it's significant progress.
We have no divine right to promotion. We're in this division as a result of 20 years of mismanagement, incompetence, underinvestment and apathy. The club was a basket case when Game changer took over; the least we can do is give them and McKenna a chance to turn the oil tanker around. |  | | |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:46 - Feb 12 with 1152 views | FrimleyBlue |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:05 - Feb 12 by Stewart27 |
No mate.
KM has been given 14 months, 2 transfer windows and more resources than any other manager. The fact that he has changed the way we play isn’t enough. We must not only play like this, but be 20 points clear top. Remember that we also have more fans now (as a result of the style of football) so that should also be used as a stick to beat him with.
In all seriousness, fantastic post.
Christ alive even now I’m thinking about us over 180 minutes against Wednesday. I know who id rather watch week in week out. |
3 transfer windows
And, between the 2 sides you mention, one is currently doing enough to be automatically promoted, id rather watch winning football over nice to look at draws personally, but then again you found yesturday pulsating, so who am i to argue. |  |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:51 - Feb 12 with 1151 views | Pique |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:31 - Feb 12 by HARRY10 |
Utter nonsense.
Any expectation on supporters part is down to the hype (as now is) from the US group, who saw promotion as an almost certainty in their first season.
"Let’s cut out the defeatist talk"
Defeatist ! From tge man who states that finishing 6th would be progress. Yes if was Evan owning the ckub and not McK as manager. And if we don't go up it is not as if we start next season 19 places ahead of the rest. There is no advantage to finishing 6th if you don't go up.
We have had xonsiderable investment, with the understanding of that being to get us into the PL. Yet here we are into the second season with every thought that we may only reach the play offs with the all uncertainty that brings
The real defeatism is your sort, who will accept anything, other than town supporters questioning the club.
Yesterdays draw with 2nd place Weds is not what has caused the questioning, but the dropped points against the likes of Lincoln, Cambridge, Oxford. 8 points out of the last 21
But 'McK is learning' goes the bleat. We are not a ruddy driving school. I exoect with alk the money and talk we would employ some FI driver, not someone doing 30mph with his L plates up.
So don't call those who question what is happening defeatists, as they are the supporters who were led to believe we would achieve better than 6th (and be grateful for it).
And if the manager cannot produce a squad capable of automatic promotion out of L1, then what hope is there if we get to the Championship ? |
We have had considerable investment, but it doesn't happen overnight. The investment in the squad only began eighteen months ago, and that was in the context of the chaos of Cook's tenure. This isn't Football Manager, you can't just splurge the cash and expect instant success, it takes time. Man City were taken over in 2008 and immediately started spending ludicrous amounts, but it still took them another four years to win the Premier League.
What we can reasonably expect is significant progress and, for now, that is what we're getting. So let's try and have a little faith in what McKenna is trying to do. | | | |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:54 - Feb 12 with 1133 views | Pique |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:46 - Feb 12 by FrimleyBlue |
3 transfer windows
And, between the 2 sides you mention, one is currently doing enough to be automatically promoted, id rather watch winning football over nice to look at draws personally, but then again you found yesturday pulsating, so who am i to argue. |
Three transfer windows, but two of them were January windows, and we all know the limitations of those, and one of those was immediately after inheriting a shambles from Cook.
You're just not being fair. | | | |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 18:02 - Feb 12 with 1092 views | FrimleyBlue |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:54 - Feb 12 by Pique |
Three transfer windows, but two of them were January windows, and we all know the limitations of those, and one of those was immediately after inheriting a shambles from Cook.
You're just not being fair. |
It's fair because he included this Jan window in his figures, so Jan windows are included, therefore it's 3 transfer windows that KM has had since he's been here. | |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 18:13 - Feb 12 with 1070 views | Pique |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 18:02 - Feb 12 by FrimleyBlue |
It's fair because he included this Jan window in his figures, so Jan windows are included, therefore it's 3 transfer windows that KM has had since he's been here. |
It's fair if you're simply looking to correct his facts. It's not fair if you're using it as an implied criticism of McKenna. And given that virtually everything you post falls into that category, you can see why I might think that. | | | |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 18:31 - Feb 12 with 1029 views | GlasgowBlue |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 16:58 - Feb 12 by Pique |
Well, if we finish 3rd or 4th there's a more than reasonable chance we go up via the play offs - some people seem to be forgetting that. Personally I think we're very capable of beating any team in this division that isn't Plymouth or Sheff Wed over two legs, and then who knows what happens at Wembley, but I'd back us to do it. So next season could still be about what it would be if we got automatic, ie consolidating our position the Championship.
But if we don't (which I'm guessing is your assumption) then next season, yes, I would expect a serious and sustained push for the League One title, which would again represent progress. Particularly given a more settled squad, another year's experience for McKenna, probably a bit more investment in the squad, no more freak season Plymouth in the division and some pretty dross teams coming down from the Championship.
And if that doesn't happen, then yes, there would be a reasonable conversation to be had about whether McKenna is the right man. I'm not saying I'd agree with replacing him - it would depend on the context of the season. But it would be a reasonable question, because we wouldn't have progressed.
But we are progressing now, so it's a daft conversation to be having now.
But to be honest, I don't really give a toss about next season right now, because we're still in the thick of an incredibly tough promotion race, and we're right in it. He has my 100% backing. |
That's far too sensible a response. | |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 18:33 - Feb 12 with 1028 views | GlasgowBlue |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:31 - Feb 12 by HARRY10 |
Utter nonsense.
Any expectation on supporters part is down to the hype (as now is) from the US group, who saw promotion as an almost certainty in their first season.
"Let’s cut out the defeatist talk"
Defeatist ! From tge man who states that finishing 6th would be progress. Yes if was Evan owning the ckub and not McK as manager. And if we don't go up it is not as if we start next season 19 places ahead of the rest. There is no advantage to finishing 6th if you don't go up.
We have had xonsiderable investment, with the understanding of that being to get us into the PL. Yet here we are into the second season with every thought that we may only reach the play offs with the all uncertainty that brings
The real defeatism is your sort, who will accept anything, other than town supporters questioning the club.
Yesterdays draw with 2nd place Weds is not what has caused the questioning, but the dropped points against the likes of Lincoln, Cambridge, Oxford. 8 points out of the last 21
But 'McK is learning' goes the bleat. We are not a ruddy driving school. I exoect with alk the money and talk we would employ some FI driver, not someone doing 30mph with his L plates up.
So don't call those who question what is happening defeatists, as they are the supporters who were led to believe we would achieve better than 6th (and be grateful for it).
And if the manager cannot produce a squad capable of automatic promotion out of L1, then what hope is there if we get to the Championship ? |
The fact that you disagree Harry, convinces me more that I am on the side of sense and reason. | |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 18:48 - Feb 12 with 985 views | FrimleyBlue |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 18:13 - Feb 12 by Pique |
It's fair if you're simply looking to correct his facts. It's not fair if you're using it as an implied criticism of McKenna. And given that virtually everything you post falls into that category, you can see why I might think that. |
There's plenty to be critical about, but you're also ignoring my posts where I support what he's trying to do, Feel that he would actually be better off in the championship with his style etc.
But you are correct at the beginning, I was simply correcting his facts. | |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:00 - Feb 12 with 976 views | patrickswell |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:46 - Feb 12 by FrimleyBlue |
3 transfer windows
And, between the 2 sides you mention, one is currently doing enough to be automatically promoted, id rather watch winning football over nice to look at draws personally, but then again you found yesturday pulsating, so who am i to argue. |
McKenna has been here for 3 transfer windows but he’s really only seriously used 2 of them.
Edit - apologies, I see Pique has already addressed this. [Post edited 12 Feb 2023 19:02]
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:23 - Feb 12 with 931 views | TalkingBlues |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:54 - Feb 12 by Pique |
Three transfer windows, but two of them were January windows, and we all know the limitations of those, and one of those was immediately after inheriting a shambles from Cook.
You're just not being fair. |
Inherited a shambles?? Lol, he inherited one of the best teams ever for League 1, Cook brought some bloody fantastic players in and at crazy good prices. |  |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:27 - Feb 12 with 916 views | TalkingBlues |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 17:37 - Feb 12 by keighleyblue |
You're either a budgie, a Plymouth or Wednesday supporter. Either way I am wasting none of my time reading your embarrassing attempts to wind the fanbase up, which incidentally are utter gash. You're on IGNORE, I suggest others do the same |
Bye  | |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:35 - Feb 12 with 895 views | Pique |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:23 - Feb 12 by TalkingBlues |
Inherited a shambles?? Lol, he inherited one of the best teams ever for League 1, Cook brought some bloody fantastic players in and at crazy good prices. |
I don't deny Cook brought some good players in, but he had no idea what to do with them and by the time he left we'd just drawn at home to Barrow, we were 11th in the league and morale was in the toilet. He absolutely left a mess. | | | |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:40 - Feb 12 with 876 views | TalkingBlues |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:35 - Feb 12 by Pique |
I don't deny Cook brought some good players in, but he had no idea what to do with them and by the time he left we'd just drawn at home to Barrow, we were 11th in the league and morale was in the toilet. He absolutely left a mess. |
Great set of players, not getting consistency out of them, some games exceptional, some games rubbish, no different to what we have now. | |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:43 - Feb 12 with 865 views | PioneerBlue |
Sense prevails at last in these threads |  |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:43 - Feb 12 with 866 views | Pique |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:40 - Feb 12 by TalkingBlues |
Great set of players, not getting consistency out of them, some games exceptional, some games rubbish, no different to what we have now. |
Well, we were a midtable team under Cook and now we're a promotion contender, so it is a little different to what we have now. | | | |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:57 - Feb 12 with 827 views | TalkingBlues |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:43 - Feb 12 by Pique |
Well, we were a midtable team under Cook and now we're a promotion contender, so it is a little different to what we have now. |
Over the first 15 games, yes, since then we’ve been a mid table team I’m sorry to say, living off the great start we had. | |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:58 - Feb 12 with 828 views | pointofblue |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:43 - Feb 12 by Pique |
Well, we were a midtable team under Cook and now we're a promotion contender, so it is a little different to what we have now. |
Over the last 23 games, we're out of the top six.
We've only played 30 in total. | |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 20:09 - Feb 12 with 811 views | Pique |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:57 - Feb 12 by TalkingBlues |
Over the first 15 games, yes, since then we’ve been a mid table team I’m sorry to say, living off the great start we had. |
Yes, but the great thing about league tables is the first 15 games count, so we're still a promotion contender.
Something that we never were under Cook, nor were we ever likely to be. | | | |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 20:11 - Feb 12 with 784 views | Pique |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:58 - Feb 12 by pointofblue |
Over the last 23 games, we're out of the top six.
We've only played 30 in total. |
Then I guess it's a good thing the first seven games count as well. If you add the points from them to the other 23, we're still third!
Phew! | | | |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 20:15 - Feb 12 with 759 views | pointofblue |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 20:11 - Feb 12 by Pique |
Then I guess it's a good thing the first seven games count as well. If you add the points from them to the other 23, we're still third!
Phew! |
But it's a sign of slipping back.
If we started slowly and were building momentum now (the first seven were instead the last seven, say), we'd be getting excited and feeling like we were making a late charge for the top two. Instead, it feels like we're stalling and, in the last two matches, put in our worst performances of the season in the first halves of both games. | |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 20:19 - Feb 12 with 726 views | GlasgowBlue |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 19:57 - Feb 12 by TalkingBlues |
Over the first 15 games, yes, since then we’ve been a mid table team I’m sorry to say, living off the great start we had. |
You don't seem to understand how the league table works.
We have played 30 games and we are in 3rd place. | |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 20:29 - Feb 12 with 709 views | Pique |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 20:15 - Feb 12 by pointofblue |
But it's a sign of slipping back.
If we started slowly and were building momentum now (the first seven were instead the last seven, say), we'd be getting excited and feeling like we were making a late charge for the top two. Instead, it feels like we're stalling and, in the last two matches, put in our worst performances of the season in the first halves of both games. |
No, it isn't necessarily a sign of slipping back - it's entirely possible that we have a season with a strong start, a mid season dip and then a strong finish, that kind of trajectory happens to teams all the time. It may well not be enough for automatic, but I never said it would be.
Are you honestly saying that if our purple patch had occurred mid season rather than at the beginning your attitude would have been any different? That you'd be on here telling people to hold their horses because we were building momentum? If you can honestly say that then fair enough, but it's a little hard to swallow.
Too many on here are still scarred by the Lambert experience. McKenna is not Lambert, they don't exist in the same footballing universe. We were rubbish under Lambert when we were top, we were rubbish under Lambert when we were 11th. By and large almost every performance under McKenna has been at the very least acceptable, and often exceptional. Cambridge was as you say totally unacceptable, but no one has ever claimed it wasn't. | | | |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 20:51 - Feb 12 with 670 views | pointofblue |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 20:29 - Feb 12 by Pique |
No, it isn't necessarily a sign of slipping back - it's entirely possible that we have a season with a strong start, a mid season dip and then a strong finish, that kind of trajectory happens to teams all the time. It may well not be enough for automatic, but I never said it would be.
Are you honestly saying that if our purple patch had occurred mid season rather than at the beginning your attitude would have been any different? That you'd be on here telling people to hold their horses because we were building momentum? If you can honestly say that then fair enough, but it's a little hard to swallow.
Too many on here are still scarred by the Lambert experience. McKenna is not Lambert, they don't exist in the same footballing universe. We were rubbish under Lambert when we were top, we were rubbish under Lambert when we were 11th. By and large almost every performance under McKenna has been at the very least acceptable, and often exceptional. Cambridge was as you say totally unacceptable, but no one has ever claimed it wasn't. |
I think people would be more positive and hopeful now had the dip happened at the start of the season, and we were now building momentum. See the Bolton or Derby forums.
Of course, the flip side would have been a lot of tension and questions being asked in September.
I agree performances are much better under McKenna than Lambert but they should be - the standard of player he has at his disposal is of far higher quality. | |
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| 11th, 9th & 11th on 21:21 - Feb 12 with 618 views | TalkingBlues |
| 11th, 9th & 11th on 20:19 - Feb 12 by GlasgowBlue |
You don't seem to understand how the league table works.
We have played 30 games and we are in 3rd place. |
When it’s put like that, to somebody who knew nothing of the journey, it would no doubt sound quite good, but drilling down even a little bit into the details and context of the season, it becomes a bit of a horror story, we just aren’t sure yet if this is one where everybody gets slaughtered, or one where somebody escapes. | |
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