| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... 22:09 - Mar 4 with 6893 views | ITFC_Forever |
.... but last night was an epiphany to me in that it made me realise, in all its raw awfulness, exactly what we have become.
And today I have felt bereft, bereaved, like someone close to me has gone.
I know life is about more than football and ITFC, but to those of us who have spent far, far more time and money than is good for them, missed various other things I could have been doing to go to games, and effectively planned my life around each season’s fixture list.... I now feel empty.
And the worst of it is, I don’t think we have reached the bottom yet.
ME can’t or won’t put any more money in.... and in the context of the football industry (as bat-sh*t mental as it is), that’s not good news.
I know a guy who works at the club, I won’t say in what capacity as it’s not fair on him and he said it simply.... “there is no money”.
Quite where we go from here, God knows. Lambert will be gone soon enough, but where we go from there I don’t know.... or don’t want to contemplate. [Post edited 4 Mar 2020 22:26]
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 10:44 - Mar 5 with 1601 views | ElephantintheRoom |
Just a thought -- but it IS just football and the fitting fate of an appallingly run football club.
Personally I don't think it would take much to put right... and if Vincent-Young had stayed fit, who knows... it may be that simple.
What baffles me from all the onion-pealing going on is that Town were utterly appalling last season, as was Lambert. To arrogantly assume all would be well this season was a giant and slightly unrealistic leap of faith. If Sunderland could make a mess of it, so could Town.... not to mention the likes of Leeds, Sheff Wed, Sheff U, Coventry, Charlton etc etc
Anyone daft (or hopeful) enough to buy a season ticket for this season should simply try and come to terms with reality and lower their delusional expectations for a while. |  |
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 11:02 - Mar 5 with 1591 views | jeera |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 10:08 - Mar 5 by Jimmy86 |
He went about things the wrong way admittedly and as I said his man management wasnt up to it, but he was always up against it coming in after Mick. Mick did do a good job with very little money, that is not disputed, however Mick was and is responsible for the weak mentality we have in this squad.
Hurst wasnt wrong when he said he wanted the players to be the best version of themselves they could possibly be.... he tried to give them a rocket after Exeter in the cup, yet another loss to a lower division team at the time and the players didn't like it and then downed tools.... the players are weak mentally and Mick had a big part to play in that, despite doing a good job on the whole |
"Mick was and is responsible for the weak mentality we have in this squad".
That doesn't even make sense. |  |
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 11:20 - Mar 5 with 1573 views | tractordownsouth |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 09:57 - Mar 5 by Jimmy86 |
The same man who has been responsible for instilling the comfort zone culture the club currently finds itself in.... was never Didzy's biggest fan, but his comments on joining Sheff Utd were telling of the mentality Mick created amongst the players.... he had a fresh challenge, where he was joining a team that expected to go out and win, or certainly try to win every game.... hearing Mick say if he was offered a point now he'd take it and not get off the bus.... what mindset does that give the players, when that was being spouted by their boss.... that culture still exists today and any manager who has come in since has battled with that from the outset.
Hurst was ultimately a disaster and his man management wasnt up to it, but was he wrong to come in and try and shake things up a bit regarding the comfort zone the players had clearly enjoyed under Mick?? |
How is taking an average Championship squad with no funds to 4 top half finishes creating a "comfort zone culture?"
The problems lie with Lambert. Hurst is equally responsible for filling half our squad with crap, but there's no way that this is Mick's doing. |  |
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 11:28 - Mar 5 with 1565 views | Darth_Koont |
Good post. And yes, I felt very similar yesterday - as if I'd lost the feeling for the club that wouldn't return even if we managed to get promoted. I just felt: "What's the point?"
It's felt a bit better today and less doom-laden. Once the emotional response fades then there's a chance to get a bit more perspective.
And thinking about it, there is at least a benefit that we seem to be seeing the real, underlying problem which is one of approach and mentality. As we've fallen down the league, we've seen that money isn't the issue it appeared to be. Yes, money can be pretty critical in the Championship but no amount of money can solve deeper structural problems. And it explains why spending money has always taken us backwards.
I think we're seeing now that we need a bigger change than a change of manager and more investment. And looks pretty clear that we need to overhaul the ownership/management structure as the most pressing concern of all. |  |
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 11:38 - Mar 5 with 1546 views | J4ck22 |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 10:08 - Mar 5 by Jimmy86 |
He went about things the wrong way admittedly and as I said his man management wasnt up to it, but he was always up against it coming in after Mick. Mick did do a good job with very little money, that is not disputed, however Mick was and is responsible for the weak mentality we have in this squad.
Hurst wasnt wrong when he said he wanted the players to be the best version of themselves they could possibly be.... he tried to give them a rocket after Exeter in the cup, yet another loss to a lower division team at the time and the players didn't like it and then downed tools.... the players are weak mentally and Mick had a big part to play in that, despite doing a good job on the whole |
It makes me sad that some people really believe that about Mick. | | | |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 12:38 - Mar 5 with 1502 views | Jimmy86 |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 11:02 - Mar 5 by jeera |
"Mick was and is responsible for the weak mentality we have in this squad".
That doesn't even make sense. |
It does make sense.... I'm saying the comfort zone culture Mick created is still evident now, hence them not being able to deal with pressure or expectancy levels of getting promoted again at the first time of asking | | | |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 12:42 - Mar 5 with 1499 views | J4ck22 |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 12:38 - Mar 5 by Jimmy86 |
It does make sense.... I'm saying the comfort zone culture Mick created is still evident now, hence them not being able to deal with pressure or expectancy levels of getting promoted again at the first time of asking |
The majority of this squad has nothing to do with Mick though?
If he was managing us in this league, he'd bloody walk it. [Post edited 5 Mar 2020 12:48]
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 12:51 - Mar 5 with 1487 views | Jimmy86 |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 12:42 - Mar 5 by J4ck22 |
The majority of this squad has nothing to do with Mick though?
If he was managing us in this league, he'd bloody walk it. [Post edited 5 Mar 2020 12:48]
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But the 2 most senior pros at the club, who are widely known to "run the dressing room" did.... I do however love Chambo and Skuse, they've been great servants to the club. Bart's interview saddened me, as they had accepted relegation in October! When the season ran until April! That's what I mean about them being weak.
When the chips are down their body language is shocking, hands on hips etc, need a rocket up their arse! | | | |
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 12:57 - Mar 5 with 1472 views | tractordownsouth |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 12:51 - Mar 5 by Jimmy86 |
But the 2 most senior pros at the club, who are widely known to "run the dressing room" did.... I do however love Chambo and Skuse, they've been great servants to the club. Bart's interview saddened me, as they had accepted relegation in October! When the season ran until April! That's what I mean about them being weak.
When the chips are down their body language is shocking, hands on hips etc, need a rocket up their arse! |
Yes but none of that is MM's fault | |
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 13:02 - Mar 5 with 1461 views | Dubtractor |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 12:51 - Mar 5 by Jimmy86 |
But the 2 most senior pros at the club, who are widely known to "run the dressing room" did.... I do however love Chambo and Skuse, they've been great servants to the club. Bart's interview saddened me, as they had accepted relegation in October! When the season ran until April! That's what I mean about them being weak.
When the chips are down their body language is shocking, hands on hips etc, need a rocket up their arse! |
There are plenty of things to criticise Mick for, a set of players that are not motivated is not remotely one of them.
Micks teams would run through walls for him. Not sure how that could be disputed. If you were to suggest it was too focused on effort rather than quality you might have a point. |  |
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 13:04 - Mar 5 with 1457 views | jeera |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 12:38 - Mar 5 by Jimmy86 |
It does make sense.... I'm saying the comfort zone culture Mick created is still evident now, hence them not being able to deal with pressure or expectancy levels of getting promoted again at the first time of asking |
I think this 'comfort' culture gets a bit overused.
And a bit misused.
To suggest that all they had to do was turn up is nonsense.
Jim got accused of the same, playing his mates and all that, as does every other manager who doesn't just do exactly what some fans want. When what they usually mean is their own favourites aren't getting played etc.
If they were lazy under Mick, we'd have been relegated sooner.
As it turns out that took someone to come in and make as many players as uncomfortable as he could.
That was the problem.
Maybe they should turn off the heating in the home changing rooms to make them really uncomfortable; maybe put small stones in their boots - that'll teach them. [Post edited 5 Mar 2020 13:13]
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 13:10 - Mar 5 with 1447 views | hochiblue |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 07:29 - Mar 5 by BlueAllOver |
Totally this - Evans is at fault for employing and currently still employing Lambert but not for the budget in League 1 - Smokescreen for Lambert to hide behind and disguise the fact he is useless. You only need to look at Coventry to see money is not a big thing in League 1
Championship yes Evans was underfunding but not this year. [Post edited 5 Mar 2020 7:46]
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Did you see in the press today that Aston Villa’s total loss last year, if you ignore the sale and lease back of the ground (apparently today’s dodge of choice) was £105million. One year only. Don’t think we’re ever going to do that, even if we wanted to. Must be heading for PL2. | | | |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 13:31 - Mar 5 with 1427 views | Jimmy86 |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 13:04 - Mar 5 by jeera |
I think this 'comfort' culture gets a bit overused.
And a bit misused.
To suggest that all they had to do was turn up is nonsense.
Jim got accused of the same, playing his mates and all that, as does every other manager who doesn't just do exactly what some fans want. When what they usually mean is their own favourites aren't getting played etc.
If they were lazy under Mick, we'd have been relegated sooner.
As it turns out that took someone to come in and make as many players as uncomfortable as he could.
That was the problem.
Maybe they should turn off the heating in the home changing rooms to make them really uncomfortable; maybe put small stones in their boots - that'll teach them. [Post edited 5 Mar 2020 13:13]
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Think my key point surrounds the fact that this season, after our decent start expectations among the fan base rose and rightly so, with our squad it is good enough to get promoted and at an absolute minimum reach the play offs.
Lambert now talks of the players not being able to deal with this level of expectancy or pressure and as such their weak mentality is being exposed.
Under Mick, who did a great job there wasnt this same level of expectancy, due to the budget constraints he was working under, which is understandable. Maybe we need better characters in the dressing room, as that squad is good enough. | | | |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 13:33 - Mar 5 with 1424 views | braveblue |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 03:12 - Mar 5 by BlueBadger |
We had a man who could motivate average players into warriors. People wanted him sacked because he said a bad word at a football match. |
Yawn | | | |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 13:34 - Mar 5 with 1421 views | sotd78 |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 03:12 - Mar 5 by BlueBadger |
We had a man who could motivate average players into warriors. People wanted him sacked because he said a bad word at a football match. |
Facts:
He swore at all of us on TV
He had already done that once before to the kids in the Lower deck of the West Stand.
His football was dull and boring and going nowhere.
He didn't care about us, the place we have in the community or our history.
I never once wished McCarthy to go; but I sure as eggs is eggs don't wish him back either. |  |
| Blue shirts/white shorts - sotd78 |
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 13:38 - Mar 5 with 1410 views | itfcjoe |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 13:31 - Mar 5 by Jimmy86 |
Think my key point surrounds the fact that this season, after our decent start expectations among the fan base rose and rightly so, with our squad it is good enough to get promoted and at an absolute minimum reach the play offs.
Lambert now talks of the players not being able to deal with this level of expectancy or pressure and as such their weak mentality is being exposed.
Under Mick, who did a great job there wasnt this same level of expectancy, due to the budget constraints he was working under, which is understandable. Maybe we need better characters in the dressing room, as that squad is good enough. |
But the players you've spoken about - the last ones from Mick's era were Bart, Sears, Skuse and Chambers - are players who have been under much more pressure than L1 fight, with better expectations.
It is up to the manager to motivate them, if he can't he either needs to get rid of them (He has Bart - but Sears and Chambers were given new contracts presumably on his say so)
There was still expectancy under Mick, they still had targets to achieve.
If there are problems with the mentality and the motivation of the playing squad it is placed squarely on Lambert's shoulders, it is literally his job to sort. All squads are different, all require different approaches and good man managers will do what they need to do to get them running through walls for him.
Which players in this squad do you think have a weak mentality? The reality is players with a weak mentality don't even make it into the pro game because it is such a dog eat dog industry |  |
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 14:01 - Mar 5 with 1377 views | Jimmy86 |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 13:38 - Mar 5 by itfcjoe |
But the players you've spoken about - the last ones from Mick's era were Bart, Sears, Skuse and Chambers - are players who have been under much more pressure than L1 fight, with better expectations.
It is up to the manager to motivate them, if he can't he either needs to get rid of them (He has Bart - but Sears and Chambers were given new contracts presumably on his say so)
There was still expectancy under Mick, they still had targets to achieve.
If there are problems with the mentality and the motivation of the playing squad it is placed squarely on Lambert's shoulders, it is literally his job to sort. All squads are different, all require different approaches and good man managers will do what they need to do to get them running through walls for him.
Which players in this squad do you think have a weak mentality? The reality is players with a weak mentality don't even make it into the pro game because it is such a dog eat dog industry |
Look at the Fleetwood gallery! There was a break in play and the majority of them were stood with their hands on their hips and with their heads down, that's where you need leadership from Lambert and someone on the pitch to pick people back up again.
Think the current problems run deep and a combination of Evan's, Lambert and also the players sees us where we currently are | | | |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 14:10 - Mar 5 with 1364 views | itfcjoe |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 14:01 - Mar 5 by Jimmy86 |
Look at the Fleetwood gallery! There was a break in play and the majority of them were stood with their hands on their hips and with their heads down, that's where you need leadership from Lambert and someone on the pitch to pick people back up again.
Think the current problems run deep and a combination of Evan's, Lambert and also the players sees us where we currently are |
I don't see that on that gallery?
I've said a few times, you can see when Lambert is up for it on the sidelines and kicking every ball - we seem to play better. It was like that when he first came in.
Why isn't he doing that every game? It's up to him to motivate if that is what the players need - he can't just do it in some games and not in others | |
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| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 14:13 - Mar 5 with 1356 views | Jimmy86 |
| My tuppence worth....This is going to sound soft.... on 14:10 - Mar 5 by itfcjoe |
I don't see that on that gallery?
I've said a few times, you can see when Lambert is up for it on the sidelines and kicking every ball - we seem to play better. It was like that when he first came in.
Why isn't he doing that every game? It's up to him to motivate if that is what the players need - he can't just do it in some games and not in others |
Yep agreed, something isn't quite right at the mo and after our great start it's such a shame | | | |
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