| Our politics is broken part 27898767 08:20 - Sep 9 with 11039 views | GlasgowBlue |
Over the weekend we’ve had Amber Rudd quit the Conservatives because it is morphing into the Brexit party. If the Tory party doesn’t have a home for Ken Clarke, Rory Stewart, Nicholas Soames or Amber Rudd but is in the thrall of the ERG then they may as well give the keys to Nigel Farage and be done with it.
Slipping slightly under the radar this weekend we also saw veteran Labour MP John Mann quit the Labour Party because of antisemitism, accusing Corbyn of not only being “an” enabler of antisemitism in the country but “the enabler.
And momentum have deselected backbencher of the year, Diana Johnson, and believe it or not have started proceedings to deselect Kier Starmer of all people.
And then we have both Jo Swinson and Layla Moran from the Lib Dem’s saying that they want a second referendum but if leave win agains they will ignore the result.
Who the hell is a centrist voter who respects democracy expected to vote for?
[Post edited 9 Sep 2019 8:30]
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:11 - Sep 9 with 2502 views | SpruceMoose |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 15:25 - Sep 9 by J2BLUE |
Agree. Can't even draw a cock these days without it being counted as a vote for Boris. |
You jest, but I once saw Gummer try to argue that a spunking penis was a vote for the Conservative as the last bit of jizz was drawn in that box.
I'm not joking. [Post edited 9 Sep 2019 16:11]
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| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:14 - Sep 9 with 2486 views | J2BLUE |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:11 - Sep 9 by SpruceMoose |
You jest, but I once saw Gummer try to argue that a spunking penis was a vote for the Conservative as the last bit of jizz was drawn in that box.
I'm not joking. [Post edited 9 Sep 2019 16:11]
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Worth a try I guess. |  |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:17 - Sep 9 with 2478 views | SpruceMoose |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:14 - Sep 9 by J2BLUE |
Worth a try I guess. |
Odious little twerp.
Him. Not you. | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:27 - Sep 9 with 2453 views | GeoffSentence |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:17 - Sep 9 by SpruceMoose |
Odious little twerp.
Him. Not you. |
John or Ben? |  |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:27 - Sep 9 with 2453 views | BrixtonBlue |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 15:16 - Sep 9 by J2BLUE |
Ad yet if you suggest not voting is a viable option some people start banging on about how you have to vote. Absolute stupidity. If there was an election tomorrow I wouldn't be voting. |
Indeed. I was slaughtered on here for saying the very same a while back. |  |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:31 - Sep 9 with 2441 views | SpruceMoose |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:27 - Sep 9 by GeoffSentence |
John or Ben? |
Young Benjamin | |
| Pronouns: He/Him/His.
"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:36 - Sep 9 with 2436 views | itfcjoe |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 15:41 - Sep 9 by ActionMan |
Our voters are broken, the politics just reflects our society. When the majority of political activists do their so called high level debate by "schooling" people on Twitter or when people see political news they don't like decide an Ipswich Town forum is the best place to air their views then what chance does real change have. None.
People are conditioned to vote for the same thing minus a few small variables in blue, red and yellow rosettes and then wonder why those same parties, people and politics end up causing the same disastrous results. Why the f'k is someone like Ken Clarke still a factor in politics, causing the same self interested chaos and disruption he has for god knows how many years while profiting from peoples misery in his own private business interests and then acts as if he's morally superior to anyone over his pro-EU stance. He's a tool, John Major was a tool, Thatcher was outright mad, Blair an evil piece of sh7t, Brown a toadie that got what he deserved, Cameron and aristocratic half witted coward, May the worst of them all and now Boris Johnson, by virtue he was the least rubbish out of an entire collection of sh7t that is the current crop of Tory MP's.
If you want change, get off the internet, join a party, or form your own, knock on some doors, challenge your MP's, do some street stalls. But you won't you'll keep voting for the same parties, and complaining about their dire performance form the other side of a phone screen. None of your beloved politicians care, they are doing their job to earn money, not to change anything, as proven over the last 35 years in this country and what a complete f'up your beloved blues, reds and yellows have made of it. |
I think most on this board are fairly open - there are a few in each corner but the majority seem to be floatingvoters. I reckon most people on here who talk politics have not voted the same way across the last few elections - I've voted for everyone this decade alone (Tory, Labour, LD and Greens) |  |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 17:15 - Sep 9 with 2397 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 10:41 - Sep 9 by Radlett_blue |
Yes and some want the voting age reduced to 16. |
Plenty of 16 year olds have a far greater understanding and appreciation of politics than people in their 20s, 30s, 40s etc.
On a personal level, I feel politically homeless right now and I think that is true of a serious % of the population. As someone else said earlier, the parties aren't able to agree on what they stand for so what hope do we have in choosing who to elect? [Post edited 9 Sep 2019 17:17]
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 18:04 - Sep 9 with 2366 views | Radlett_blue |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 17:15 - Sep 9 by tractorboy1978 |
Plenty of 16 year olds have a far greater understanding and appreciation of politics than people in their 20s, 30s, 40s etc.
On a personal level, I feel politically homeless right now and I think that is true of a serious % of the population. As someone else said earlier, the parties aren't able to agree on what they stand for so what hope do we have in choosing who to elect? [Post edited 9 Sep 2019 17:17]
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A flawed analysis as you are not comparing like with like. Yes, I agree that some 16 year olds will have a better understanding of politics than some older people, but that is no argument for extending the vote to 16 year olds, unless you think that most 16 & 17 year olds are sufficiently knowledgeable or as knowledgeable as the rest of the electorate. |  |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 18:14 - Sep 9 with 2354 views | jaykay |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 16:31 - Sep 9 by SpruceMoose |
Young Benjamin |
so those burgers were tainted  |  |
| forensic experts say footers and spruces fingerprints were not found at the scene after the weekends rows |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 18:17 - Sep 9 with 2347 views | footers |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 18:04 - Sep 9 by Radlett_blue |
A flawed analysis as you are not comparing like with like. Yes, I agree that some 16 year olds will have a better understanding of politics than some older people, but that is no argument for extending the vote to 16 year olds, unless you think that most 16 & 17 year olds are sufficiently knowledgeable or as knowledgeable as the rest of the electorate. |
In which case we should introduce some sort of aptitude test for voting. A basic understanding of representative democracy would be a good place to start.
The fact that so many were searching "What is the EU?" the day after the vote is a strong argument for this type of testing. |  |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 18:19 - Sep 9 with 2343 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 18:04 - Sep 9 by Radlett_blue |
A flawed analysis as you are not comparing like with like. Yes, I agree that some 16 year olds will have a better understanding of politics than some older people, but that is no argument for extending the vote to 16 year olds, unless you think that most 16 & 17 year olds are sufficiently knowledgeable or as knowledgeable as the rest of the electorate. |
I've not done an analysis of how politically engaged/knowledgeable 16/17 year olds are en masse compared to any other age group. But I am not sure 'most' of any other age group are sufficiently knowledgeable if I am honest. | | | |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 20:15 - Sep 9 with 2285 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 18:17 - Sep 9 by footers |
In which case we should introduce some sort of aptitude test for voting. A basic understanding of representative democracy would be a good place to start.
The fact that so many were searching "What is the EU?" the day after the vote is a strong argument for this type of testing. |
Indeed but it seems taboo to say that people aren't well equipped or informed enough to vote. | | | |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 20:27 - Sep 9 with 2271 views | footers |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 20:15 - Sep 9 by tractorboy1978 |
Indeed but it seems taboo to say that people aren't well equipped or informed enough to vote. |
Some of the things I've heard over the last nearly four years have really made me question how much Joe Bloggs knows about our political system. That's a problem. If you aren't aware of how things work and your rights as a citizen, then surely we've failed somewhere down the line?
It's also the responsibility of everyone to know this- very basic- stuff. We can all argue about the fairness of the system, but you need to equip yourself with the knowledge first.
The further you detach yourself from democracy, the more rights you're willing to give away to vested parties appreciative your ignorance. | |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 20:31 - Sep 9 with 2251 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 20:27 - Sep 9 by footers |
Some of the things I've heard over the last nearly four years have really made me question how much Joe Bloggs knows about our political system. That's a problem. If you aren't aware of how things work and your rights as a citizen, then surely we've failed somewhere down the line?
It's also the responsibility of everyone to know this- very basic- stuff. We can all argue about the fairness of the system, but you need to equip yourself with the knowledge first.
The further you detach yourself from democracy, the more rights you're willing to give away to vested parties appreciative your ignorance. |
Similarly the plebs are not taught about economics/money. |  |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 20:36 - Sep 9 with 2238 views | footers |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 20:31 - Sep 9 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Similarly the plebs are not taught about economics/money. |
"You just don't understand the readers, do you, eh? He's the bloke you see in the pub, a right old fascist, wants to send the w0gs back, buy his poxy council house, he's afraid of the unions, afraid of the Russians, hates the qu*ers and the weirdos and drug dealers. He doesn't want to hear about that stuff (serious news)."
- Kelvin MacKenzie, Sun Editor, 81-94, proponent of this level of discourse. [Post edited 9 Sep 2019 21:40]
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 21:10 - Sep 9 with 2206 views | The_Romford_Blue |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 10:51 - Sep 9 by GlasgowBlue |
Our two main political parties are not fit for the 21st century.
We have the Tories longing for the 1950’s and Labour stuck in the 1970’s. |
I think that’s spot on Glassers.
How can the two main parties be so inept? |  |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 21:15 - Sep 9 with 2196 views | WeWereZombies |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 20:31 - Sep 9 by BanksterDebtSlave |
Similarly the plebs are not taught about economics/money. |
'the' plebs? Not 'us' plebs? |  |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 21:23 - Sep 9 with 2190 views | tractorboy1978 |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 20:27 - Sep 9 by footers |
Some of the things I've heard over the last nearly four years have really made me question how much Joe Bloggs knows about our political system. That's a problem. If you aren't aware of how things work and your rights as a citizen, then surely we've failed somewhere down the line?
It's also the responsibility of everyone to know this- very basic- stuff. We can all argue about the fairness of the system, but you need to equip yourself with the knowledge first.
The further you detach yourself from democracy, the more rights you're willing to give away to vested parties appreciative your ignorance. |
People also seem to take everything they read or hear at face value too. The £350m to the NHS slogan on the bus is the ultimate example of this. I've come across more than a couple of handfuls of people that voted on this basis alone.
There is of course an argument that politicians should be more honest but this is highly indicative of society generally. We now live within a real "sound byte culture" where headlines are full of lies, falsehoods and exaggerations and these can be more easily spread than ever by social media. People are lazy and easily misled. [Post edited 9 Sep 2019 21:31]
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 21:32 - Sep 9 with 2164 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 20:36 - Sep 9 by footers |
"You just don't understand the readers, do you, eh? He's the bloke you see in the pub, a right old fascist, wants to send the w0gs back, buy his poxy council house, he's afraid of the unions, afraid of the Russians, hates the qu*ers and the weirdos and drug dealers. He doesn't want to hear about that stuff (serious news)."
- Kelvin MacKenzie, Sun Editor, 81-94, proponent of this level of discourse. [Post edited 9 Sep 2019 21:40]
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Don't think it is permissible to use such language even though you a attributing it to others.
Think you need to do an edit. Wouldn't like to see the thread removed just because one poster thinks he is clever. |  |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 21:42 - Sep 9 with 2144 views | BanksterDebtSlave |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 21:15 - Sep 9 by WeWereZombies |
'the' plebs? Not 'us' plebs? |
Mmm I thought my inclusion with the plebs was just a given....who amongst us was taught about any of that routinely?
Edit..."us" would make assumptions about all of you in virtual world. [Post edited 9 Sep 2019 21:43]
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 21:42 - Sep 9 with 2144 views | footers |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 21:32 - Sep 9 by Pinewoodblue |
Don't think it is permissible to use such language even though you a attributing it to others.
Think you need to do an edit. Wouldn't like to see the thread removed just because one poster thinks he is clever. |
I have attributed it to the correct source.
The language should shock you; it's intended to do just that. | |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 21:57 - Sep 9 with 2118 views | Pinewoodblue |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 21:42 - Sep 9 by footers |
I have attributed it to the correct source.
The language should shock you; it's intended to do just that. |
Coming from the source quoted it shouldn't shock anyone. | |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 22:04 - Sep 9 with 2110 views | footers |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 21:57 - Sep 9 by Pinewoodblue |
Coming from the source quoted it shouldn't shock anyone. |
Quite. But his editorial stance is now our normal, apparently. This is what we've sunk to.
He and others just want to infantilise the working class. They don't care about real things, best play on their fears instead. | |
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| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 22:22 - Sep 9 with 2089 views | Ewan_Oozami |
| Our politics is broken part 27898767 on 15:41 - Sep 9 by ActionMan |
Our voters are broken, the politics just reflects our society. When the majority of political activists do their so called high level debate by "schooling" people on Twitter or when people see political news they don't like decide an Ipswich Town forum is the best place to air their views then what chance does real change have. None.
People are conditioned to vote for the same thing minus a few small variables in blue, red and yellow rosettes and then wonder why those same parties, people and politics end up causing the same disastrous results. Why the f'k is someone like Ken Clarke still a factor in politics, causing the same self interested chaos and disruption he has for god knows how many years while profiting from peoples misery in his own private business interests and then acts as if he's morally superior to anyone over his pro-EU stance. He's a tool, John Major was a tool, Thatcher was outright mad, Blair an evil piece of sh7t, Brown a toadie that got what he deserved, Cameron and aristocratic half witted coward, May the worst of them all and now Boris Johnson, by virtue he was the least rubbish out of an entire collection of sh7t that is the current crop of Tory MP's.
If you want change, get off the internet, join a party, or form your own, knock on some doors, challenge your MP's, do some street stalls. But you won't you'll keep voting for the same parties, and complaining about their dire performance form the other side of a phone screen. None of your beloved politicians care, they are doing their job to earn money, not to change anything, as proven over the last 35 years in this country and what a complete f'up your beloved blues, reds and yellows have made of it. |
Come on then, let's start the LOLDROL party (that's Left of Liberal Democrats-Right of Labour - basically the very small niche political space where my political view exists)
We could start here:
https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/sites/default/files/pdf_file/intro-regist
Of course, you could campaign as an Independent, where you don't need to register a party name: see here:
https://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/i-am-a/candidate-or-agent
This is the problem - barriers to entry are quite high, and would we be a single-issue party, like the BXP, a climate change party, like the Greens, a wacky party like the MRLP, or a mainstream party?
And if we were to campaign as an Independent, would that be based on local issues, eg, the Northern Bypass, or in opposition to an existing candidate or party?
The reason why Farage got where he did is because he took a single issue, went on about it for years and years, got the backing of some dodgy wealthy people and now we are where we are.
If I was to base any political policy on anything, I'd start with these two books:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/How-Be-Right-world-wrong/dp/0753553120/ref=pd_bxgy_14_i
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Why-We-Get-Wrong-Politicians/dp/1782399755/ref=pd_rhf_e [Post edited 9 Sep 2019 22:23]
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