| Do we need another Centre Back? 12:41 - Jan 10 with 3207 views | OriginalMarkyP |
Woolfie
Burgess
Edmundson
JD
Keogh
Baggot & Ndaba out on loan.
On paper I'd say it looks not, but if we have the capacity and funds it might be worth it.
Working on the supposition the Woofie and Burg start...
Keogh's age makes him a bit part player. Im sure if injuries dictacted he could step up for an extended period but it would not be the ideal solution.
Edmundson is great on his day, but form seems to have become more inconsistent of late and to me I think he seems to be carrying some kind of injury. A run could see him get back to last season's form though.
JD...can always move across but we lose elsewhere obvs
The on loan pair are just that.
I wouldn't be averse to a Centreback of the same calibre of Hirst and Broadhead coming in...
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 12:42 - Jan 10 with 2640 views | Kieran_Knows |
If and when we go up, we will look to replace Donacien and Burgess. |  |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 12:42 - Jan 10 with 2634 views | Wallingford_Boy |
Yeah why not, one more wouldn't hurt.
We are loaded, after all. |  |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 12:54 - Jan 10 with 2555 views | Scuzzer |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 12:42 - Jan 10 by Kieran_Knows |
If and when we go up, we will look to replace Donacien and Burgess. |
Really? |  |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:04 - Jan 10 with 2490 views | NthQldITFC |
There's always Leigh who could probably do a very good job in there too. I feel for him, he deserves to have had a much bigger role this season.
Nice use of 'averse' in this context, rather than the oft-ill-used 'adverse' which always winds me up, but I'm too much of a coward/gentleman to comment.  |  |
| # WE ARE STEALING THE FUTURE FROM OUR CHILDREN --- WE MUST CHANGE COURSE # | | Poll: | It's driving me nuts |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:05 - Jan 10 with 2479 views | FrimleyBlue |
I wouldn't be surprised if we don't find another Donacien.
He's great. But with such an advanced position within attacking phases, his lack of crossing/shot ability doesn't help.
Of course naturally it's all about defending. But with so much time spent in the final third I do sometimes wonder if KM might want someone new there. |  |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:07 - Jan 10 with 2455 views | SheffordBlue |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:05 - Jan 10 by FrimleyBlue |
I wouldn't be surprised if we don't find another Donacien.
He's great. But with such an advanced position within attacking phases, his lack of crossing/shot ability doesn't help.
Of course naturally it's all about defending. But with so much time spent in the final third I do sometimes wonder if KM might want someone new there. |
For someone poor at crossing he's joint 2nd with a number of other players for assists! |  |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:08 - Jan 10 with 2439 views | NthQldITFC |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 12:54 - Jan 10 by Scuzzer |
Really? |
That does seem very harsh to me too, particularly on Donacien who has been absolutely magnificent, but I kind of get it, cos I'm not sure Donacien would be able to do opponents with his timing (which is what I think his greatest strength is) at the top of the Championship.
Having said that I would be more than happy for both of them to play for us at that level. | |
| # WE ARE STEALING THE FUTURE FROM OUR CHILDREN --- WE MUST CHANGE COURSE # | | Poll: | It's driving me nuts |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:09 - Jan 10 with 2432 views | ArnieM |
It’s the “ quality “ of our CB’s that I have issue with. Burgess is the best CB , Keogh is back up in my view, Woolfie might good bring ball out but is prone to errors in DEFENDING every game, as is Edmundson (where was he for Rotherham’s goal?) . We need a decent string in the box / air CB who ideally can also be happy on the ball and bring it out . I’m honestly not sure what Woolfies best position is. I don’t trust him ( or Edmundson) as “ defenders”. One’s comfortable on the ball ( but then do can a deep sitting midfielder do that role), the other isn’t and looks to pass the ball anywhere quickly , but has poor judgement of situations and makes the wrong decisions I’m my view.
We need better . This defence is nowhere good enough for next level up …… in my humble opinion of course! |  |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:13 - Jan 10 with 2382 views | StokieBlue |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:09 - Jan 10 by ArnieM |
It’s the “ quality “ of our CB’s that I have issue with. Burgess is the best CB , Keogh is back up in my view, Woolfie might good bring ball out but is prone to errors in DEFENDING every game, as is Edmundson (where was he for Rotherham’s goal?) . We need a decent string in the box / air CB who ideally can also be happy on the ball and bring it out . I’m honestly not sure what Woolfies best position is. I don’t trust him ( or Edmundson) as “ defenders”. One’s comfortable on the ball ( but then do can a deep sitting midfielder do that role), the other isn’t and looks to pass the ball anywhere quickly , but has poor judgement of situations and makes the wrong decisions I’m my view.
We need better . This defence is nowhere good enough for next level up …… in my humble opinion of course! |
Absolute nonsense from you yet again.
Digging out Edmundson because Keogh clearly messed up is quite the narrative.
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:29 - Jan 10 with 2294 views | BigCommon |
I think we're ok atm... Ball would have been handy as a back up. We ve got 5 CBS, with Leigh ,Davis, KVY as makeshift back up. Not ideal but doable....If we were to up grade on our first choice I could see us waiting to see if we get promoted, then spending on a real upgrade, if KM deems necessary. Which could be done in the Summer. Im sure theyll be putting feelers out, if automatic promotion looks likely. Tbf, though, the rate of Burgess improvement under the current staff, would suggest that there's nothing to stop any of them improving further as the season goes on. Come Summer, you'd have to say that Keogh would drop out.Which would make room for a quality arrival..Have to say, I wanted to see Baggot get involved. But wonder if him and Ndaba a will cut it in Championship, if we go up. [Post edited 10 Jan 2023 13:30]
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:43 - Jan 10 with 2154 views | Garv |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:09 - Jan 10 by ArnieM |
It’s the “ quality “ of our CB’s that I have issue with. Burgess is the best CB , Keogh is back up in my view, Woolfie might good bring ball out but is prone to errors in DEFENDING every game, as is Edmundson (where was he for Rotherham’s goal?) . We need a decent string in the box / air CB who ideally can also be happy on the ball and bring it out . I’m honestly not sure what Woolfies best position is. I don’t trust him ( or Edmundson) as “ defenders”. One’s comfortable on the ball ( but then do can a deep sitting midfielder do that role), the other isn’t and looks to pass the ball anywhere quickly , but has poor judgement of situations and makes the wrong decisions I’m my view.
We need better . This defence is nowhere good enough for next level up …… in my humble opinion of course! |
Ridiculously harsh on Edmundson. If anything he probably hangs onto the ball too long. |  |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:54 - Jan 10 with 2095 views | homer_123 |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:09 - Jan 10 by ArnieM |
It’s the “ quality “ of our CB’s that I have issue with. Burgess is the best CB , Keogh is back up in my view, Woolfie might good bring ball out but is prone to errors in DEFENDING every game, as is Edmundson (where was he for Rotherham’s goal?) . We need a decent string in the box / air CB who ideally can also be happy on the ball and bring it out . I’m honestly not sure what Woolfies best position is. I don’t trust him ( or Edmundson) as “ defenders”. One’s comfortable on the ball ( but then do can a deep sitting midfielder do that role), the other isn’t and looks to pass the ball anywhere quickly , but has poor judgement of situations and makes the wrong decisions I’m my view.
We need better . This defence is nowhere good enough for next level up …… in my humble opinion of course! |
Well, I suppose your narrative has moved on from not good enough for L1 to not good enough for the next level.
If we were a team that looked to defend and play on the break, I could see your thinking. In a MM sense, keep it tight, don't let them score and nick a goal.
Under KM, we don't play that way. We defend from the front and look to regain possession up the top of the pitch. We use our defenders to play out from the back, to venture up the pitch to create overloads and triangles with the midfield and forwards. Therefore, KM looks for attributes from our defenders that fit that mould. Comfortable on the ball as one of the main top attributes. It's clear he is happy that this comes above some of the more traditional attributes of a defender.
In essence, the modern defender at L1 or even Championship level you are not going to get the complete the player. It's very clear that if we had old skool centre backs in there it completely and utterly ruins the style and approach KM wants to play.
James Wilson is the prime example. a good traditional defender but in this team would actually be massively problematic and we'd suffer greatly for having that type of player in our squad right now. [Post edited 10 Jan 2023 15:00]
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 14:15 - Jan 10 with 1958 views | chicoazul |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 12:54 - Jan 10 by Scuzzer |
Really? |
You’re not asking me so beg pardon but yes, definitely. Which would be very tough on Janoi in particular who I hope we keep but we would need next-level experience in that position especially. |  |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 14:18 - Jan 10 with 1942 views | OldFart71 |
the problem would arise if Woolfy or Burgess were out for any length of time. It always looks like KVY is a makeshift for Donacien, but not really pushing him. I think should we go up a League Donacien will have to be used as the backup to another signing. KVY may be moved on. When we played Plymouth because Jackson was used instead of Burns who was injured it exposed Donacien to a two v one on several occasions. I'm happy with the goalkeeper situation as both are adequate for this and a higher division. Midfield may also have to be strengthen, but that depends on the setup and are we going to dominate Championship sides like we do in Division One ? A higher grade CB would I feel be required in the Championship. Whether McKenna thinks we need another now is anyone's guess. | | | |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 14:54 - Jan 10 with 1798 views | ArnieM |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:43 - Jan 10 by Garv |
Ridiculously harsh on Edmundson. If anything he probably hangs onto the ball too long. |
Do you mean caught in possession, or closed down? See, to me that’s what I’m trying to say, he often makes the wrong decisions , gets caught snd often leads to a goal. I know defenders make mistakes. But ours don’t recover from them . Saturday is forced to make a challenge as he tried to cover for that error.
I’ve seen Edmundson get caught up the park on a number of occasions this season. He’s not happy “ on the ball” snd is ponderous in my HUMBLE OPINION >>>( SB!) .
But we all see it differently. I was just trying give my thoughts on how I’ve seen it over the season. Surely no one can regrets our ability to give soft goals away almost every game it seems , especially when we’ve been “ in total control”. It’s happening far too often to be a one off incidence. So in my humble opinion we need a good solid CB in the squad . What’s wrong with that? Are we not allowed to hold an opinion about the squad / team >>> ( SB???) | |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:00 - Jan 10 with 1776 views | SheffordBlue |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 14:54 - Jan 10 by ArnieM |
Do you mean caught in possession, or closed down? See, to me that’s what I’m trying to say, he often makes the wrong decisions , gets caught snd often leads to a goal. I know defenders make mistakes. But ours don’t recover from them . Saturday is forced to make a challenge as he tried to cover for that error.
I’ve seen Edmundson get caught up the park on a number of occasions this season. He’s not happy “ on the ball” snd is ponderous in my HUMBLE OPINION >>>( SB!) .
But we all see it differently. I was just trying give my thoughts on how I’ve seen it over the season. Surely no one can regrets our ability to give soft goals away almost every game it seems , especially when we’ve been “ in total control”. It’s happening far too often to be a one off incidence. So in my humble opinion we need a good solid CB in the squad . What’s wrong with that? Are we not allowed to hold an opinion about the squad / team >>> ( SB???) |
Is he caught in possession or is he executing (or failing to execute) "La Pausa". When Woolfie and Edmundson dawdle on the ball I think that's tactical choice rather than not being very good.
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:02 - Jan 10 with 1767 views | ArnieM |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:54 - Jan 10 by homer_123 |
Well, I suppose your narrative has moved on from not good enough for L1 to not good enough for the next level.
If we were a team that looked to defend and play on the break, I could see your thinking. In a MM sense, keep it tight, don't let them score and nick a goal.
Under KM, we don't play that way. We defend from the front and look to regain possession up the top of the pitch. We use our defenders to play out from the back, to venture up the pitch to create overloads and triangles with the midfield and forwards. Therefore, KM looks for attributes from our defenders that fit that mould. Comfortable on the ball as one of the main top attributes. It's clear he is happy that this comes above some of the more traditional attributes of a defender.
In essence, the modern defender at L1 or even Championship level you are not going to get the complete the player. It's very clear that if we had old skool centre backs in there it completely and utterly ruins the style and approach KM wants to play.
James Wilson is the prime example. a good traditional defender but in this team would actually be massively problematic and we'd suffer greatly for having that type of player in our squad right now. [Post edited 10 Jan 2023 15:00]
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Thank you for your response. A good piece of I may say.
I’ve not “moved on”really, this remains part of our problem as I see it. We are building for the championship level throughout the team- but not defence (yet). The only CB “ comfortable “ on the ball is Woolfie. He likes bringing it out snd that fits with McK approach ( which I like btw). But as an out snd out defender he is found wanting in my view. That’s not me trashing him (or Edmundson for that matter ). I’m just saying what I see and feel is an area of weakness, that needs addressing. | |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:03 - Jan 10 with 1756 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:00 - Jan 10 by SheffordBlue |
Is he caught in possession or is he executing (or failing to execute) "La Pausa". When Woolfie and Edmundson dawdle on the ball I think that's tactical choice rather than not being very good.
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I've noticed very recently tho that we certainly invite the press almost to the point of losing the ball. Morsy. Evans. Aluko.. all pass at the very last minute.
I find with edmundson however that because he's not left footed. It just ruins his natural game.
But I'm also of opinion that like burns.. People view George with last season eyes and not this season. | |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:08 - Jan 10 with 1725 views | ArnieM |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:00 - Jan 10 by SheffordBlue |
Is he caught in possession or is he executing (or failing to execute) "La Pausa". When Woolfie and Edmundson dawdle on the ball I think that's tactical choice rather than not being very good.
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Yes do clearly look to invite opponents to make a move. Nearly gives me kittens at times tbh . Woolfie is better at that ( more comfortable), Edmundson isn’t ( in my view) and will get caught . Again just my view. An area of the team ( quality of defender issue) going forwards and even at this level.
That’s really all I’m saying . We need, in humble opinion, better CB. If I was way off the mark here I think we’d be seeing Edmundson in the team more . We’re seeing less, so that to me says McK had sussed this potential problem out to a point. That’s not me intending to “ have a go “ at any player but just highlighting what I’m seeing and my view on it. | |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:09 - Jan 10 with 1719 views | SheffordBlue |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:03 - Jan 10 by FrimleyBlue |
I've noticed very recently tho that we certainly invite the press almost to the point of losing the ball. Morsy. Evans. Aluko.. all pass at the very last minute.
I find with edmundson however that because he's not left footed. It just ruins his natural game.
But I'm also of opinion that like burns.. People view George with last season eyes and not this season. |
If everyone is doing it then that suggests to me it's tactical direction rather than individual choice - it's certainly a way to break a press and find space.
Fridge definitely suffering from being on his weaker side. If Woolfie were to pick up a knock/suspension I'd be happy seeing him on his stronger side and don't think we'd see a big drop off. | |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:23 - Jan 10 with 1643 views | FrimleyBlue |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:09 - Jan 10 by SheffordBlue |
If everyone is doing it then that suggests to me it's tactical direction rather than individual choice - it's certainly a way to break a press and find space.
Fridge definitely suffering from being on his weaker side. If Woolfie were to pick up a knock/suspension I'd be happy seeing him on his stronger side and don't think we'd see a big drop off. |
Oh yeah, sorry I did mean the first part as it's a clear method KM has installed into the team, I just meant with George it doesn't come naturally on that weaker side, hence him losing the ball alot more than others or gifting the ball with a weak 10 yard pass etc.
But agree, if he's covering Wolfenden, I wouldn't mind, but we miss a LCB option other than Burgess imo. | |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:29 - Jan 10 with 1620 views | homer_123 |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:02 - Jan 10 by ArnieM |
Thank you for your response. A good piece of I may say.
I’ve not “moved on”really, this remains part of our problem as I see it. We are building for the championship level throughout the team- but not defence (yet). The only CB “ comfortable “ on the ball is Woolfie. He likes bringing it out snd that fits with McK approach ( which I like btw). But as an out snd out defender he is found wanting in my view. That’s not me trashing him (or Edmundson for that matter ). I’m just saying what I see and feel is an area of weakness, that needs addressing. |
Yep, I can see you're calling it out as what you see as a weakness.
I guess, what I see if def different. The wider picture is that we need defenders who are good on the ball, that can start an attack or passage of play and to KM and the way he has us set out to play, it's that that is more important than outright defending.
Ergo, I suspect that, as much as KM wants us to keep clean sheets, he is working on a slightly Royle'esq approach of if the opposition score, I believe we'll score at least 1 more than they do.
In an ideal world we'd have ball playing attacking defenders who are excellent defenders but in L1 and even the Championship you simply don't get them - you are trading abilities off against each other at this level.
KM sees that the balance he wants is more of the ability to play out from the back and create than defend. To be fair, its working.
JD, KVY, Legih, Davis, Wollfy, Edmundson and Burgess, for me, are more than we need to get out of this division. And for me, KM is right, bolster our attacking options and be a little more ruthless up front, and that will see us promoted as we'll outscore the opposition.
That's not to say we don't need to improve if we go up, but right now, I think the Club have the priorities right. [Post edited 10 Jan 2023 16:32]
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 15:34 - Jan 10 with 1592 views | Deano69 |
I think we will look for another defender........ |  |
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| Do we need another Centre Back? on 16:56 - Jan 10 with 1383 views | Stewart27 |
| Do we need another Centre Back? on 13:09 - Jan 10 by ArnieM |
It’s the “ quality “ of our CB’s that I have issue with. Burgess is the best CB , Keogh is back up in my view, Woolfie might good bring ball out but is prone to errors in DEFENDING every game, as is Edmundson (where was he for Rotherham’s goal?) . We need a decent string in the box / air CB who ideally can also be happy on the ball and bring it out . I’m honestly not sure what Woolfies best position is. I don’t trust him ( or Edmundson) as “ defenders”. One’s comfortable on the ball ( but then do can a deep sitting midfielder do that role), the other isn’t and looks to pass the ball anywhere quickly , but has poor judgement of situations and makes the wrong decisions I’m my view.
We need better . This defence is nowhere good enough for next level up …… in my humble opinion of course! |
If you don’t think that we are incredibly lucky to have Woolfenden then you don’t know anything about football.
He’s an absolute Rolls Royce. | | | |
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