| Just got this message 20:15 - Apr 21 with 3314 views | gtsb1966 |
Ex local referee. Not a Town supporter but a massive football fan. Was talking to him about VAR and modern day football. Not saying I agree about leagues 1 and 2 but I get the gist. I couldn't agree more. ....Gerry I've always maintained that no one and nothing can have the same view as the referee has during a game so his decision should be absolute especially as it's one that's made almost instantly. Now you have players constantly cheating, Managers out of control and, in the Premiership at least, far too much money. Sky TVs money was the beginning of the end, cameras everywhere, replays galore, decisions crucified in post match discussions and the man/men in black hung out to dry. Money and the suits have ruined the once beautiful game, fans are being fleeced and the latest FA Cup decision regarding replays is another nail in the coffin for every team outside of the PL and especially for the non league. I despair at what the game has become and currently take far more pleasure from Leagues 1 and 2. |  | | |  |
| Just got this message on 20:48 - Apr 21 with 2973 views | ArnieM |
I be been saying the same re Sky for years, I hate them. |  |
| |
| Just got this message on 20:54 - Apr 21 with 2925 views | nshearman1 |
Well said that man! |  | | |
| Just got this message on 21:20 - Apr 21 with 2765 views | Bigalhunter |
It’s a hideously difficult, and probably irretrievable situation now.
All the other major sports moved towards technology, such rugby, cricket, tennis, with varying degrees of success.
Football has managed to make an utter mess of it, probably because it is a far more intricate game.
VAR has turned handball, contact in the box and offside into a farce. The only place technology seems to work well, is with the goal line technology.
I saw someone on here point out that VAR is the inevitable result of the previously pathetic antics of the Warnocks and others, along with the endless analysis on tv, with their multiple cameras at every top flight game.
All it has done though, is give Klopp, Mourinho, Guardiola and Arteta new things to behave like hysterical 7 year olds about.
The other issue of football, as a fairly equal game for all sides, disappeared the minute it became terminally ill in 1992 under the neglect of Dr Sky. It suffered a slow and painful demise in the ensuing years and has had its corpse relentlessly desecrated ever since.
That said, as the season reaches its conclusion, I find myself behaving like a lunatic as Ipswich close in on a possible return to the top division, something I never thought I’d see again.
Why do I want to subject myself to all that monstrous injustice and insanity? Dunno, but it’s so close now I just want to bathe in its intoxicating, illicit, luxuriant filth for a bit... |  | | |
| Just got this message on 21:38 - Apr 21 with 2641 views | redrickstuhaart |
| Just got this message on 21:20 - Apr 21 by Bigalhunter |
It’s a hideously difficult, and probably irretrievable situation now.
All the other major sports moved towards technology, such rugby, cricket, tennis, with varying degrees of success.
Football has managed to make an utter mess of it, probably because it is a far more intricate game.
VAR has turned handball, contact in the box and offside into a farce. The only place technology seems to work well, is with the goal line technology.
I saw someone on here point out that VAR is the inevitable result of the previously pathetic antics of the Warnocks and others, along with the endless analysis on tv, with their multiple cameras at every top flight game.
All it has done though, is give Klopp, Mourinho, Guardiola and Arteta new things to behave like hysterical 7 year olds about.
The other issue of football, as a fairly equal game for all sides, disappeared the minute it became terminally ill in 1992 under the neglect of Dr Sky. It suffered a slow and painful demise in the ensuing years and has had its corpse relentlessly desecrated ever since.
That said, as the season reaches its conclusion, I find myself behaving like a lunatic as Ipswich close in on a possible return to the top division, something I never thought I’d see again.
Why do I want to subject myself to all that monstrous injustice and insanity? Dunno, but it’s so close now I just want to bathe in its intoxicating, illicit, luxuriant filth for a bit... |
The irony is that with sensible rules, allowing proper discretion from referees and judgments to be made, rather than codes trying to address every possible situation, it could work perfectly well. But that is not what has happened.
For instance:
Handball- has to be deliberate in Refs opinion. Full stop. A goal scored with hand is disallowed, irrespective. A goal prevented by hand, regardless of intent, is given as a penalty goal. Done.
Offside- a player is offside unless, in ref's opinion, he is not influencing or affecting the play. A level player is onside and attacker gets benefit of the doubt. Unless var shows, beyond reasonable doubt, that a player was offside when the ball was played, the attacker gets benefit of the doubt. Done. | | | |
| Just got this message on 21:40 - Apr 21 with 2619 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
Pundits questioning and analysing every decision and blaming officials for getting them wrong and having too much impact on the matches led to it.
However, VAR has not changed any of that. Its main impact is to slow down the game and increase controversy. If it only got involved in clear and obvious errors such a when a player was clearly offside and the officials missed it or when the ball is clearly put in with a hand but not seen, it would be much better. However, those in charge seem incapable of getting it to work. That would suggest we are better off without it. |  |
| |
| Just got this message on 21:42 - Apr 21 with 2582 views | Nthsuffolkblue |
| Just got this message on 21:38 - Apr 21 by redrickstuhaart |
The irony is that with sensible rules, allowing proper discretion from referees and judgments to be made, rather than codes trying to address every possible situation, it could work perfectly well. But that is not what has happened.
For instance:
Handball- has to be deliberate in Refs opinion. Full stop. A goal scored with hand is disallowed, irrespective. A goal prevented by hand, regardless of intent, is given as a penalty goal. Done.
Offside- a player is offside unless, in ref's opinion, he is not influencing or affecting the play. A level player is onside and attacker gets benefit of the doubt. Unless var shows, beyond reasonable doubt, that a player was offside when the ball was played, the attacker gets benefit of the doubt. Done. |
I particularly like the penalty goal option. No red card just the goal stands as if it hadn't been stopped. | |
| |
| Just got this message on 23:05 - Apr 21 with 2301 views | WicklowBlue |
| Just got this message on 21:20 - Apr 21 by Bigalhunter |
It’s a hideously difficult, and probably irretrievable situation now.
All the other major sports moved towards technology, such rugby, cricket, tennis, with varying degrees of success.
Football has managed to make an utter mess of it, probably because it is a far more intricate game.
VAR has turned handball, contact in the box and offside into a farce. The only place technology seems to work well, is with the goal line technology.
I saw someone on here point out that VAR is the inevitable result of the previously pathetic antics of the Warnocks and others, along with the endless analysis on tv, with their multiple cameras at every top flight game.
All it has done though, is give Klopp, Mourinho, Guardiola and Arteta new things to behave like hysterical 7 year olds about.
The other issue of football, as a fairly equal game for all sides, disappeared the minute it became terminally ill in 1992 under the neglect of Dr Sky. It suffered a slow and painful demise in the ensuing years and has had its corpse relentlessly desecrated ever since.
That said, as the season reaches its conclusion, I find myself behaving like a lunatic as Ipswich close in on a possible return to the top division, something I never thought I’d see again.
Why do I want to subject myself to all that monstrous injustice and insanity? Dunno, but it’s so close now I just want to bathe in its intoxicating, illicit, luxuriant filth for a bit... |
Rugby and Cricket are far more intricate games rules wise. The difference between the technology is down to implementation.
Hockey rescinded the offside rule 2 decades ago, that was controversial as a lot of people (myself included) felt that it would lead to players goal hanging. In fact what it did do is open up the game to more variety of plays.
How about just bin offside and be done with it? |  | | |
| Just got this message on 08:47 - Apr 22 with 1644 views | Stewart27 |
| Just got this message on 23:05 - Apr 21 by WicklowBlue |
Rugby and Cricket are far more intricate games rules wise. The difference between the technology is down to implementation.
Hockey rescinded the offside rule 2 decades ago, that was controversial as a lot of people (myself included) felt that it would lead to players goal hanging. In fact what it did do is open up the game to more variety of plays.
How about just bin offside and be done with it? |
Rugby is fantastic.
You get two intelligent people talking to one another and debating the footage. One of those the ref and one in the control room. Everybody can hear it and they pretty much always come to the right decision though use of the footage and good old common sense.
Doesn’t feel like the ref is hung out to dry. Quite the opposite. | | | |
Login to get fewer ads
| Just got this message on 09:34 - Apr 22 with 1494 views | GeoffSentence |
| Just got this message on 23:05 - Apr 21 by WicklowBlue |
Rugby and Cricket are far more intricate games rules wise. The difference between the technology is down to implementation.
Hockey rescinded the offside rule 2 decades ago, that was controversial as a lot of people (myself included) felt that it would lead to players goal hanging. In fact what it did do is open up the game to more variety of plays.
How about just bin offside and be done with it? |
The long ball over the top isnt a thing in hockey though, is it?
Get rid of offside in football and the plays you open up the hoofball plays to a goal hanger. |  |
| |
| Just got this message on 09:46 - Apr 22 with 1432 views | Radlett_blue |
| Just got this message on 09:34 - Apr 22 by GeoffSentence |
The long ball over the top isnt a thing in hockey though, is it?
Get rid of offside in football and the plays you open up the hoofball plays to a goal hanger. |
If you have played or watched good level hockey, you would know that the "aerial" i.e. a long ball over the top, is now an integral part of the game, although it's used more to by-pass the congested midfield & get the ball to a player in the attacking third.
Hockey has made umpteen changes to its rules, partly as a result of the move from grass to artificial surfaces. e.g. after an offence, the player awarded the free hit can simply dribble the ball, while the defenders have to retreat 5 yards. |  |
| |
| Just got this message on 09:52 - Apr 22 with 1413 views | _clive_baker_ |
I make him right |  | | |
| Just got this message on 09:53 - Apr 22 with 1408 views | _clive_baker_ |
| Just got this message on 09:46 - Apr 22 by Radlett_blue |
If you have played or watched good level hockey, you would know that the "aerial" i.e. a long ball over the top, is now an integral part of the game, although it's used more to by-pass the congested midfield & get the ball to a player in the attacking third.
Hockey has made umpteen changes to its rules, partly as a result of the move from grass to artificial surfaces. e.g. after an offence, the player awarded the free hit can simply dribble the ball, while the defenders have to retreat 5 yards. |
I know nothing about hockey. Long aerial balls sound dangerous to me! [Post edited 22 Apr 10:06]
| | | |
| Just got this message on 09:55 - Apr 22 with 1384 views | Radlett_blue |
| Just got this message on 09:53 - Apr 22 by _clive_baker_ |
I know nothing about hockey. Long aerial balls sound dangerous to me! [Post edited 22 Apr 10:06]
|
They are if attempted by unskilled players so they generally don't play them. | |
| |
| Just got this message on 10:00 - Apr 22 with 1369 views | Steve_M |
| Just got this message on 21:20 - Apr 21 by Bigalhunter |
It’s a hideously difficult, and probably irretrievable situation now.
All the other major sports moved towards technology, such rugby, cricket, tennis, with varying degrees of success.
Football has managed to make an utter mess of it, probably because it is a far more intricate game.
VAR has turned handball, contact in the box and offside into a farce. The only place technology seems to work well, is with the goal line technology.
I saw someone on here point out that VAR is the inevitable result of the previously pathetic antics of the Warnocks and others, along with the endless analysis on tv, with their multiple cameras at every top flight game.
All it has done though, is give Klopp, Mourinho, Guardiola and Arteta new things to behave like hysterical 7 year olds about.
The other issue of football, as a fairly equal game for all sides, disappeared the minute it became terminally ill in 1992 under the neglect of Dr Sky. It suffered a slow and painful demise in the ensuing years and has had its corpse relentlessly desecrated ever since.
That said, as the season reaches its conclusion, I find myself behaving like a lunatic as Ipswich close in on a possible return to the top division, something I never thought I’d see again.
Why do I want to subject myself to all that monstrous injustice and insanity? Dunno, but it’s so close now I just want to bathe in its intoxicating, illicit, luxuriant filth for a bit... |
"I saw someone on here point out that VAR is the inevitable result of the previously pathetic antics of the Warnocks and others, along with the endless analysis on tv, with their multiple cameras at every top flight game."
There was a piece in When Saturday Comes years ago predicting the inevitable result of VAR would be managers moaning about biased decisions from the eighth official; it was very predictable.
Football has still managed to make an utter mess of technology though; partly the game doesn't have the natural breaks in that help with cricket and, to a lesser extent, rugby but also the lazy media culture that prioritises 'controversy' over analysis of the game.
Adding VAR was just satisfying the football-media industry, making the game more about them.
And FWIW, I think the flag probably would have gone up for that offside yesterday without VAR - but that is still preferable to the manifest unfairness of a highly subjective decision on a marginal call. |  |
| |
| Just got this message on 10:05 - Apr 22 with 1324 views | tonybied |
| Just got this message on 09:34 - Apr 22 by GeoffSentence |
The long ball over the top isnt a thing in hockey though, is it?
Get rid of offside in football and the plays you open up the hoofball plays to a goal hanger. |
Most teams press and defend from the front nowadays. If you stick a player on the goal keeper all the time you lose a player from this tactic. I don't think many teams would deploy a player in this way and even if they did what it so wrong with it anyway? It would just change the way a team has to defend. |  | | |
| Just got this message on 10:08 - Apr 22 with 1300 views | _clive_baker_ |
| Just got this message on 09:55 - Apr 22 by Radlett_blue |
They are if attempted by unskilled players so they generally don't play them. |
Fair enough. My only experience of hockey was a little bit at school, those balls are pretty hard, I wouldn't fancy one of those on the bonce. | | | |
| Just got this message on 10:09 - Apr 22 with 1290 views | Radlett_blue |
| Just got this message on 10:08 - Apr 22 by _clive_baker_ |
Fair enough. My only experience of hockey was a little bit at school, those balls are pretty hard, I wouldn't fancy one of those on the bonce. |
My son plays hockey regularly & yes, as a hard ball game with little protection visits to casualty are not unknown. Players at high levels routinely wear face masks when defending short corners. | |
| |
| Just got this message on 10:12 - Apr 22 with 1263 views | _clive_baker_ |
| Just got this message on 10:09 - Apr 22 by Radlett_blue |
My son plays hockey regularly & yes, as a hard ball game with little protection visits to casualty are not unknown. Players at high levels routinely wear face masks when defending short corners. |
You've also got the backswing risk as well, I remember being very aware of that when behind someone.
Not for me Clive. But maybe I'm just a p***y. | | | |
| Just got this message on 10:22 - Apr 22 with 1221 views | Lesta_Tractor |
| Just got this message on 21:38 - Apr 21 by redrickstuhaart |
The irony is that with sensible rules, allowing proper discretion from referees and judgments to be made, rather than codes trying to address every possible situation, it could work perfectly well. But that is not what has happened.
For instance:
Handball- has to be deliberate in Refs opinion. Full stop. A goal scored with hand is disallowed, irrespective. A goal prevented by hand, regardless of intent, is given as a penalty goal. Done.
Offside- a player is offside unless, in ref's opinion, he is not influencing or affecting the play. A level player is onside and attacker gets benefit of the doubt. Unless var shows, beyond reasonable doubt, that a player was offside when the ball was played, the attacker gets benefit of the doubt. Done. |
Easiest way to fix the offside rule is to just get rid of it like the hockey rule makers did. |  |
| |
| Just got this message on 11:34 - Apr 22 with 1022 views | Lesta_Tractor |
| Just got this message on 10:09 - Apr 22 by Radlett_blue |
My son plays hockey regularly & yes, as a hard ball game with little protection visits to casualty are not unknown. Players at high levels routinely wear face masks when defending short corners. |
Urgh... I hate those face masks, I'd almost rather a trip to the dentist!
I've seen some of our lower standard teams try and play an aerial and put the ball straight in to the car park, which is why I quite often walk to hockey 😂 | |
| |
| Just got this message on 12:32 - Apr 22 with 885 views | Freddies_Ears |
| Just got this message on 11:34 - Apr 22 by Lesta_Tractor |
Urgh... I hate those face masks, I'd almost rather a trip to the dentist!
I've seen some of our lower standard teams try and play an aerial and put the ball straight in to the car park, which is why I quite often walk to hockey 😂 |
I had a work colleague who played hockey at a decent level, and made sure always to wear a mouth-guard. Unfortunately it proved ineffective. Leading to a year of living off soup, waiting for her teeth to reset. Yuk. | | | |
| Just got this message on 12:36 - Apr 22 with 859 views | Lesta_Tractor |
| Just got this message on 12:32 - Apr 22 by Freddies_Ears |
I had a work colleague who played hockey at a decent level, and made sure always to wear a mouth-guard. Unfortunately it proved ineffective. Leading to a year of living off soup, waiting for her teeth to reset. Yuk. |
I lost my front teeth taking a stick to the face despite wearing a mouth guard.
One of the best players I've shared a pitch with took a drag flick to the face which broke his jaw and pushed the bottom row of teeth inwards, the doctors weren't really sure what to do with him when I dropped him off at A&E. | |
| |
| Just got this message on 12:47 - Apr 22 with 796 views | charlie1 |
| Just got this message on 12:36 - Apr 22 by Lesta_Tractor |
I lost my front teeth taking a stick to the face despite wearing a mouth guard.
One of the best players I've shared a pitch with took a drag flick to the face which broke his jaw and pushed the bottom row of teeth inwards, the doctors weren't really sure what to do with him when I dropped him off at A&E. |
Hockey is a massively under-rated sport.
The technical skills needed are really high, and the dangers very apparent.
Yet it’s almost impossible to make a living wage from the professional game, even at the very highest level. | | | |
| Just got this message on 13:25 - Apr 22 with 711 views | Radlett_blue |
| Just got this message on 12:47 - Apr 22 by charlie1 |
Hockey is a massively under-rated sport.
The technical skills needed are really high, and the dangers very apparent.
Yet it’s almost impossible to make a living wage from the professional game, even at the very highest level. |
Hockey is better to play than watch. The game at the highest level has been ruined as a spectacle by the advent of rolling subs, which means that players never get tired and space rarely appears. | |
| |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
