| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country 08:29 - Apr 24 with 5380 views | NthQldITFC |
...back towards a decent and fairish place to live.
Brazen shoplifting gangs item on R4 just now.
Clogged up justice system.
Experienced coppers disillusioned and gone.
Health services packing up.
Corporate disdain for environmental and human rights responsibilities.
Infrastructure absolutely f**ked.
...it goes on and on and on doesn't it.
Many of us are very well off with big investment portfolios, second homes, three cars, big pensions. We have taken too much and we have to start giving back if we don't want this to spiral down to an utterly dystopian sh!t-hole. Don't instinctively rebel against higher taxation without thinking why it is required.
Please think about society and environment before adding to your personal pile of 'wealth' if you value the thought of a decent future for you and yours and everybody else's.
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| # WE ARE STEALING THE FUTURE FROM OUR CHILDREN --- WE MUST CHANGE COURSE # | | Poll: | It's driving me nuts |
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| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 13:46 - Apr 25 with 494 views | jayessess |
| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 12:09 - Apr 25 by chicoazul |
Note everyone how this poster doesn’t say I’m wrong. |
Specifically this part - "our highest levels of taxation since WW2" - is wrong at this precise moment in time.
The rest of it, well, that's a matter of opinion. |  |
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| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 14:12 - Apr 25 with 449 views | DJR |
| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 13:46 - Apr 25 by jayessess |
Specifically this part - "our highest levels of taxation since WW2" - is wrong at this precise moment in time.
The rest of it, well, that's a matter of opinion. |
I don't think I've seen it claimed that taxes are currently higher than WW2 but I think there may be an element of splitting hairs here.
This from the following article.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68494168#:~:text=%27The%20highest%20tax%2
'The highest tax burden for 70 years' - Keir Starmer
Mr Starmer is right - the overall level of taxation last year was the highest for more than 70 years (1954).
And it is forecast to get higher.
The Office for Budget Responsibility (OBR) - the independent body which makes forecasts for the government - predicts that it will collect 37.1p of every pound generated in the economy in 2028-29.
That would be the highest level in 80 years (1944). [Post edited 25 Apr 14:22]
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| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 14:20 - Apr 25 with 428 views | N2_Blue |
| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 10:09 - Apr 25 by Pinewoodblue |
But Starmer keeps telling us that tax levels are going up all the time so it must be true.
Personally I think it would be better to increase tax levels while, at the same time, raising tax allowances.
The amount that can be earned before tax is paid needs increasing by at least £1,000 and there need to be more tax bands, a gradual increase not the big jump up from standard rate. Bring back the 10% starting rate, and add an interim band between current standard & higher rates.
Merge income tax & employee NI and make state pension tax free. |
I've always thought this regarding having more tax bands.
To increase tax or not increase is always such a big political point and fundamental to any party mainfesto.
But why are taxation levels always mentioned rather than the tax bands. The massive jump between standard and higher rates doesn't make much sense to me. It would bring in more revenue and be a better scale of afordability to all.
I guess because its something that would never get voted in... [Post edited 25 Apr 14:26]
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| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 14:21 - Apr 25 with 427 views | DJR |
| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 09:48 - Apr 25 by jayessess |
Always wonder how this meme about "the highest levels of taxation since the war" spread so rapidly? It's obviously an incredibly counter-intuitive thing to believe, given that high taxes in the 1960s and 1970s is a bit of a national legend (90% top rate of income tax!). None of the most relevant tax categories (income tax, sales tax, corporation tax) are at historically very high levels.
It seems to come from an OBR report suggesting Britain would have the highest tax to GDP ratio since the war by 2027-28 if average incomes rise and if tax thresholds for National Insurance and Income Tax don't change (meaning poorer people will be pulled into higher tax brackets).
(See here: https://obr.uk/box/the-uks-tax-burden-in-historical-and-international-context/ )
Essentially it was a warning about poorer people being pulled into higher tax brackets rather than about people with "investment portfolios" contributing more to the exchequer.
The overall tax burden relative to GDP in Britain remains much lower than most Western European countries. [Post edited 25 Apr 10:14]
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I think the very high rate of tax was as a result of the investment income surcharge which very few people would have paid, but a large part of the explanation is down to things like indirect taxes (VAT was I think 8% in the 70s and is now 20%) and stealth taxes (eg not raising the bands at which higher rates of income tax kick in).
This is a good explainer.
https://ifs.org.uk/taxlab/taxlab-key-questions/how-have-government-revenues-chan | | | |
| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 14:50 - Apr 25 with 382 views | jayessess |
| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 14:21 - Apr 25 by DJR |
I think the very high rate of tax was as a result of the investment income surcharge which very few people would have paid, but a large part of the explanation is down to things like indirect taxes (VAT was I think 8% in the 70s and is now 20%) and stealth taxes (eg not raising the bands at which higher rates of income tax kick in).
This is a good explainer.
https://ifs.org.uk/taxlab/taxlab-key-questions/how-have-government-revenues-chan |
but again, you look at their charts and tax levels relative to GDP are pretty constant between the end of the Major Government until 2020 and still remain below several of the peaks in the 1970s and 1980s.
I think rendering "taxes will occupy a greater proportion of GDP than they have for 70 years if tax thresholds remain the same and incomes go up as forecast" as "highest tax burden for 70 years" would be a bit misleading for most people, particularly when what you are discussing is the efficacy of government spending. | |
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| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 21:35 - Apr 25 with 263 views | DJR |
| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 14:50 - Apr 25 by jayessess |
but again, you look at their charts and tax levels relative to GDP are pretty constant between the end of the Major Government until 2020 and still remain below several of the peaks in the 1970s and 1980s.
I think rendering "taxes will occupy a greater proportion of GDP than they have for 70 years if tax thresholds remain the same and incomes go up as forecast" as "highest tax burden for 70 years" would be a bit misleading for most people, particularly when what you are discussing is the efficacy of government spending. |
The table shows two sets of data, total government receipts and total taxes. The former is larger because it also includes things like surpluses of public sector industries, rent from state-owned properties and so on.
If you look at the date for total taxes, you will see that it is higher than in the 1970s and 1980s, and is indeed the highest for 70 years.
Leaving that aside, a very large factor in the very high tax burden by reference to GDP is the very sluggish growth since 2010. | | | |
| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 04:14 - Apr 26 with 185 views | mellowblue |
| We're all going to have to make some selfless sacrifices to get this country on 14:21 - Apr 25 by DJR |
I think the very high rate of tax was as a result of the investment income surcharge which very few people would have paid, but a large part of the explanation is down to things like indirect taxes (VAT was I think 8% in the 70s and is now 20%) and stealth taxes (eg not raising the bands at which higher rates of income tax kick in).
This is a good explainer.
https://ifs.org.uk/taxlab/taxlab-key-questions/how-have-government-revenues-chan |
There was a split sales tax in the 70's 8% standard and 25% (which was halved to 12.5% mid 70s) for luxury goods cars tvs etc. Then harmonised to 15% to pay for income tax changes by Mrs T. |  | | |
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