| Question for the Eco warriers on here 10:17 - Oct 20 with 4193 views | bluelagos |
Understand there are lots of ways to reduce our Co2 emissions / carbon footprint, but how can we ever be carbon neutral?
Just by eating say plant based diets, we still have an impact, tools for farmers need to be made, food needs to be moved. We need clothes. We need heating in winter.
So even after we go as green as possible, surely we will still generating a carbon footprint? Whaf am I missing? |  |
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| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 17:55 - Oct 20 with 654 views | agentp |
| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 16:47 - Oct 20 by J2BLUE |
So you're using anecdotal evidence and your own made up stats? I don't think I said we could be entirely neutral anyway. I just said that is a way to make a big impact and would leave land over to further reduce carbon with trees etc. I don't think we need to be entirely carbon neutral do we? Just need to dramatically reduce our emissions? |
Yes, in a way because no one has concrete evidence. I am sure you are making your decisions on a similar basis. However, I think it appears fairly obvious that we won't ever be able to feed the planet and be Carbon neutral whatever combination of food production we use. Currently, we are compounding the issue by overproducing/underproducing geographically.
What we need is evidence and we won't be getting that without the slant that someone organisation with a vested interest will produce.
Recycling is a classic example. We add hugely to our carbon footprint trying to recycle in the name of recycling - it's madness and big business for those who can manipulate the system. |  |
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| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 18:27 - Oct 20 with 640 views | jeera |
| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 16:36 - Oct 20 by J2BLUE |
We could use Mars as a dump? |
The other way mate.
Into that big yellow incinerator thing. |  |
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| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 20:26 - Oct 20 with 629 views | Ryorry |
| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 11:47 - Oct 20 by J2BLUE |
'The size of the worlds population could never be provided with enough food and medicine without having a negative carbon effect.'
Animals produce methane. If we started eating some of the massive amount of crops we grow just to feed animals we could actually feed the entire world with much less of a carbon cost and we'd have a shed load more land left over which we could use to plant trees etc and offset even more. |
It's not as simple as that though, e.g. -
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| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 20:48 - Oct 20 with 615 views | Ryorry |
| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 11:21 - Oct 20 by agentp |
We have evolved beyond ever being carbon neutral or being able to offset it. The size of the worlds population could never be provided with enough food and medicine without having a negative carbon effect.
We need to deny people food and the right to life achieve neutrality.
That said we can make a huge difference. The issue that I see that most people want others to change while denying their own responsibilities. A friends daughter - due to her rural location, has a taxi take her to college everyday - 120m round trip. Two holidays a year to Thailand and Ibiza and eats mainly fruit - imported. Buys shed loads of cr4p online, she is always protesting for us to change the way we live. [Post edited 20 Oct 2019 11:22]
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"The size of the worlds population"
This is an elephant in the room (sorry!) that never seems to be discussed in depth, for understandable reasons. I think a point is coming, pretty soon, when we (I mean the whole world, not just the TWTD Brains Trust*) will need to though.
Which leads onto my second main point. We in the UK are doing pretty well to overall reduce our carbon footprint I think; the main problem lies in countries like China, the USA, India, Russia.
http://worldpopulationreview.com/countries/pollution-by-country/
The table below, despite only showing the latest readings as 2017, is interesting for the landmass as well as per capita comparisons. Some middle Eastern countries which are obviously not poor in monetary terms but are obviously rich in sunshine & oil, should hang their heads in shame.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_dioxide_emissions
*anyone else old enough to remember that BBC programme?! [Post edited 20 Oct 2019 20:50]
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| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 22:26 - Oct 20 with 590 views | StokieBlue |
Well that was a rubbish match but as promised I'm back to lend my tuppence.
So of the things you listed I don't see why any of them can't be close to carbon neutral, as I said before though, it would rely on some technologies (both existing and proposed) that might not be popular.
It's also unlikely we could be fully carbon neutral but we could like get close given infinity funding and will (impossible I know).
"Just by eating say plant based diets, we still have an impact, tools for farmers need to be made, food needs to be moved. We need clothes. We need heating in winter."
Nearly all of these are energy based issues (except the tools). They could be solved by moving to a totally renewable and nuclear based energy infrastructure along with hydrogen based vehicles for transportation of goods (produced via nuclear energy). Obviously there is a carbon footprint in creating some of the infrastructure but that would need to be the caveat. Even on that there could be something done like using concrete blocks made using sequestered carbon (this is being tested at the moment).
The issue of raw materials could possibly be solved by asteroid mining (never a favourite on here and still many years away). The cost of launches would be far less than running open pit mines all across the globe and there are nearly limitless materials in the asteroids in the solar system. Pie in the sky stuff maybe but it's all theoretically possible and research is being funded.
Things like clothes isn't something I know a lot about but I assume that the materials could be fairly low carbon or even synthetic in many cases.
Flying is an issue but eventually they will find a way to get enough energy into batteries - electric engines aren't an issue and have been available for a long time - they will be made more efficient.
In the end it's all down to the energy infrastructure in my opinion. If enough resources were poured into removing all the fossil fuels and replacing them with renewables for power and nuclear for baseline then that solves a lot of issues right away. It would have to be global though and it would cost a fortune. After that hydrogen made with the carbon-neutral energy infrastructure would be the sensible way to run trucks and shipping moving goods around the world.
It's not going to happen overnight though, perhaps it will never happen at all.
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 22:30 - Oct 20 with 584 views | StokieBlue |
| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 16:14 - Oct 20 by sparks |
In the long run, new trees wont help that much. New trees will capture carbon, and then when they die, get used, decompose, burn etc- they release it again... |
Whilst correct in the majority there are a minority of trees which might not fall foul to the points you raise.
For instance, giant sequoias are beautiful, huge and can live for 3000 years. Not perfect but certainly some possible breathing room. Obviously any tree based approach will take a long time though and would be caveated on the trees themselves being protected as much as possible.
Once again though, it might not be realistic as an overall strategy but it's something that doesn't hurt in the shorter to mid term.
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| Avatar - IC410 - Tadpoles Nebula |
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| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 23:29 - Oct 20 with 552 views | J2BLUE |
| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 20:26 - Oct 20 by Ryorry |
It's not as simple as that though, e.g. -
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Well i'm doing my bit. Only buying organic milk where they use that kind of system. Little meat in my diet etc. |  |
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| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 23:37 - Oct 20 with 548 views | jeera |
| Question for the Eco warriers on here on 23:29 - Oct 20 by J2BLUE |
Well i'm doing my bit. Only buying organic milk where they use that kind of system. Little meat in my diet etc. |
I'm currently doing my bit by only eating stuff from my freezer.
I'll decide which direction to take once it's empty. | |
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