| Electric buses 08:18 - Dec 7 with 1802 views | hampstead_blue |
So, today Labour are offering a nationwide fleet of electric buses by 2030.
I love a podcast by Chris Harris, Collecting Cars.
In the episode with Andrew Frankel they discuss electric cars. One key point is weight and child labour in the DoC for the mining of metals for the batteries.
I'm a huge advocate of zero emission vehicles. Recently we've taken on Tesla and Toyota as clients. I've been to the Toyota training academy and the stand out vehicle is the hydrogen car.
One of the senior trainers at Toyota is of the view that Hydrogen will become the main fuel of choice over time.
Next year's Tokyo Olympics Toyota will have a fleet of hydrogen powered vehicles shuttling people around.
I seriously doubt electric buses are the solution. What if they are obsolete after just a few years. A huge sunk cost.
I don't think they have thought it through and are just throwing stuff at the wall.
Invest in hydrogen and electric infrastructure and reduce the VAT on those vehicles.
That will rapidly reduce the carbon footprint and give people cheaper vehicles. |  |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
| | Poll: | Best Blackpool goal |
| |  |
| Electric buses on 11:22 - Dec 7 with 390 views | GaryCooper |
We can not charge the vehicles, there is nowhere near enough distribution capacity in the UK electricity network. |  | | |
| Electric buses on 11:26 - Dec 7 with 385 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Electric buses on 11:03 - Dec 7 by EdwardStone |
Top o' the morning to you MiLord
I suppose....squariel, 8 track, Betamax, Phillips 2000 (?) all those bits of super new tech that were good, a big step forward but never actually hit the bullseye on the target they were aiming for |
Yo Edward
I was back to the Dam last week and I popped into one of the pubs I took you in and the girl behind the bar said you were the most drunken man she had ever seen and that you couldn't stand up. |  |
| |
| Electric buses on 11:51 - Dec 7 with 363 views | EdwardStone |
| Electric buses on 11:26 - Dec 7 by Lord_Lucan |
Yo Edward
I was back to the Dam last week and I popped into one of the pubs I took you in and the girl behind the bar said you were the most drunken man she had ever seen and that you couldn't stand up. |
Yes....I think I remember the start of the sesh….lots of strangely flavoured Jenever
The rest of the evening is beyond recall. I thought that I went into standby mode....unable to walk or talk, but not actually falling-down drunk
Many thanks, I enjoyed our meet thoroughly….beers and food are on me next time we hook up |  | | |
| Electric buses on 12:04 - Dec 7 with 358 views | hampstead_blue |
| Electric buses on 08:40 - Dec 7 by ElephantintheRoom |
Two little snags that Toyota are struggling to overcome
1. Where does the hydrogen come from?
2. How do you stop it going BOOOOOM?
At present both seem unaswerable - hence the obsession with useless battery powered vehicles |
I did ask them about the boom bit. Thry had a really technical answer which escapes me but they weren't worried. | |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
| | Poll: | Best Blackpool goal |
| |
| Electric buses on 12:05 - Dec 7 with 357 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Electric buses on 11:51 - Dec 7 by EdwardStone |
Yes....I think I remember the start of the sesh….lots of strangely flavoured Jenever
The rest of the evening is beyond recall. I thought that I went into standby mode....unable to walk or talk, but not actually falling-down drunk
Many thanks, I enjoyed our meet thoroughly….beers and food are on me next time we hook up |
Ah yes I remember now, I seemed to pick up the €150 gin tab as you were a gibbering wreck.Quite frankly I'm surprised you are still alive.
Don't worry about it, it was a pleasure. | |
| |
| Electric buses on 12:09 - Dec 7 with 350 views | hampstead_blue |
| Electric buses on 10:42 - Dec 7 by eireblue |
Let’s use a little bit of logical extrapolation.
I believe your are a fan.
“What if they are obsolete after just a few years”
Under what circumstances would electrical vehicles be obsolete in a few years?
In a few years you are suggesting that an alternative will exist, such that all electrical vehicles would be obsolete. The country will have a full network of hydrogen charging stations, in a few years, that are more convenient than using, the existing electrical network.
Also that new technology would need to be so superior, it would make sense to have existing technology marked as obsolete. As an example, Petrol cars are not yet obsolete. No one is talking about ditching petrol stations. But you think in a few years there will be a technology that exists such that everyone will ditch electrical charging stations, as an example.
Seems to me, in your keenness to express your dislike of Labour, you have lost your ability to think rationally.
Not sure that someone that lets emotion affect rational and logical extrapolation can reach trustworthy conclusions. |
The last bit about an agenda is not correct.
I asked the question to draw on others thoughts and insights.
Claphjunction has already added a few great insights.
I'm really excited at the next phase of these technologies. | |
| Assumption is to make an ass out of you and me.
Those who assume they know you, when they don't are just guessing.
Those who assume and insist they know are daft and in denial.
Those who assume, insist, and deny the truth are plain stupid.
Those who assume, insist, deny the truth and tell YOU they know you (when they don't) have an IQ in the range of 35-49.
| | Poll: | Best Blackpool goal |
| |
| Electric buses on 12:24 - Dec 7 with 339 views | No9 |
You weren't around in the 70's then?
UK was then a leader in proposals to generate hydrogen & use it in vehicles
Then we had the tories with their consderable interests in fossil fuel production and hand outs at the public expense. |  | | |
| Electric buses on 12:37 - Dec 7 with 335 views | gordon |
| Electric buses on 10:28 - Dec 7 by Clapham_Junction |
I don't think hydrogen will be the way forward except in a limited number of cases where power, distance or temperatures means electric is impractical. Electric buses will be the norm - especially as most are used in urban areas with reduced need for range. TfL have had hydrogen buses for over six years, but have decided electric is the way forward and several London bus routes are now being converted to electric only. Many Chinese cities are already using electric busses as the norm (nearly 20% of all bus routes in China are electric now).
The main issue with hydrogen is the inefficiency - it's far more efficient to put electricity straight into a battery that powers a motor, than to use the same electricity to create hydrogen and then to burn that hydrogen in an engine. We already need a very large increase in electrical generation capacity to provide the power for electric vehicles. If we went to hydrogen, then we would need to increase generation significantly more.
I personally suspect in the long-run, we may convert enough other vehicles to electric for there to be enough biofuels to continue to run the remaining vehicles (like tractors or lorries travelling through remote areas) solely on that, and hydrogen (which is more expensive and difficult to store) will be unnecessary.
But back to the original point, I think they have thought it through - the fleet manager at my organisation (who is one of the most progressive in the field) is of the opinion that all-electric is the way forward in most cases. IMO the breakthrough will not be mass conversion to hydrogen, but a new form of battery that will enable far greater storage and rapid charging (and probably fewer if any rare earth metals) [Post edited 7 Dec 2019 10:30]
|
The chances of hydrogen vehicles superceding electric vehicles in the near future (let's say 50 years) is pretty close to zero.
edit: which means I agree with the above post! [Post edited 7 Dec 2019 12:38]
|  | | |
Login to get fewer ads
| Electric buses on 12:42 - Dec 7 with 329 views | Lord_Lucan |
| Electric buses on 12:24 - Dec 7 by No9 |
You weren't around in the 70's then?
UK was then a leader in proposals to generate hydrogen & use it in vehicles
Then we had the tories with their consderable interests in fossil fuel production and hand outs at the public expense. |
Those pesky Tories in the 70,s eh No9
If it wasn't for them Wilson and or Callaghan could really have got things together! | |
| |
| Electric buses on 13:27 - Dec 7 with 319 views | GaryCooper |
| Electric buses on 12:24 - Dec 7 by No9 |
You weren't around in the 70's then?
UK was then a leader in proposals to generate hydrogen & use it in vehicles
Then we had the tories with their consderable interests in fossil fuel production and hand outs at the public expense. |
Are you genuinely saying that the hard left Union controlled labour party had no interests in fossil fuel production? | | | |
| Electric buses on 14:17 - Dec 7 with 300 views | eireblue |
| Electric buses on 12:09 - Dec 7 by hampstead_blue |
The last bit about an agenda is not correct.
I asked the question to draw on others thoughts and insights.
Claphjunction has already added a few great insights.
I'm really excited at the next phase of these technologies. |
“I don't think they have thought it through and are just throwing stuff at the wall.
”
I believe you have posted on Labour and Corbyn, and I think you have expressed somewhat negative viewpoint.
You could have a perfectly good discussion on fueling transport and not mention a political party.
I don’t see how you have made a logical conclusion, merely an emotional one. |  | | |
| Electric buses on 14:33 - Dec 7 with 290 views | No9 |
| Electric buses on 12:42 - Dec 7 by Lord_Lucan |
Those pesky Tories in the 70,s eh No9
If it wasn't for them Wilson and or Callaghan could really have got things together! |
Things were progressing well with hydrogen + other clean fuels
Look at Peter Lilley's interests | | | |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
