| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day 16:10 - Dec 11 with 8055 views | GeoffSentence |
Since parliament can't sort this out for themselves.
But what will be on the ballot paper?
My bet is that it would be May's deal vs No Deal.
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:18 - Dec 11 with 4018 views | J2BLUE |
Parliament block no deal.
Deal vs remain. |  |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:20 - Dec 11 with 4015 views | TIB |
My vote will go to whatever will stop me from having to hear the word "deal" ever again  |  |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:24 - Dec 11 with 3991 views | wkj |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:20 - Dec 11 by TIB |
My vote will go to whatever will stop me from having to hear the word "deal" ever again |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:27 - Dec 11 with 3965 views | Darth_Koont |
10 more years of this nonsense?
vs.
Let's forget about it, remain in the EU and start sorting ourselves out as a country. |  |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:28 - Dec 11 with 3971 views | Swansea_Blue |
I'm just waiting for Bercow to say "oh ffs, I give up. You lot can all p1ss off early for Christmas and I'll clear up the mess". |  |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:28 - Dec 11 with 3969 views | GeoffSentence |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:18 - Dec 11 by J2BLUE |
Parliament block no deal.
Deal vs remain. |
If remain isn't on the paper I would not legitimise it by voting | |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:30 - Dec 11 with 3958 views | wkj |
To be honest with you, that would be the most democratic ballot while staying true to the original referendum - However I do think it should be a case of running the entire thing again, but with greater clarity on what "Leave" will actually mean. | |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:34 - Dec 11 with 3934 views | BlueBadger |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:27 - Dec 11 by Darth_Koont |
10 more years of this nonsense?
vs.
Let's forget about it, remain in the EU and start sorting ourselves out as a country. |
Sadly, I fear option 2 would involve too much growing the f*ck up as a nation to countenance. |  |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:36 - Dec 11 with 3934 views | Herbivore |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:30 - Dec 11 by wkj |
To be honest with you, that would be the most democratic ballot while staying true to the original referendum - However I do think it should be a case of running the entire thing again, but with greater clarity on what "Leave" will actually mean. |
Would it he democratic to not offer an option that 15m plus voted for last time and would do again if given the chance? |  |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:39 - Dec 11 with 3920 views | wkj |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:36 - Dec 11 by Herbivore |
Would it he democratic to not offer an option that 15m plus voted for last time and would do again if given the chance? |
Im not 100% sure what you mean, and wont assume anything - My reference to most democratic were the options set out in the OP | |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:41 - Dec 11 with 3897 views | Darth_Koont |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:34 - Dec 11 by BlueBadger |
Sadly, I fear option 2 would involve too much growing the f*ck up as a nation to countenance. |
We could just say:
Lose control vs Take back control
The fact that "taking back control" is now about putting an end to the damaging chaos and political circus of Brexit is just a detail. | |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:02 - Dec 11 with 3847 views | Herbivore |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 16:39 - Dec 11 by wkj |
Im not 100% sure what you mean, and wont assume anything - My reference to most democratic were the options set out in the OP |
You say it would be democratic not to include remain on the ballot, I disagree given that 15m plus people voted remain last time and would want to again. You can't just bracket off nearly half the electorate like that and claim democracy. | |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:19 - Dec 11 with 3811 views | BloomBlue |
That would be the correct democratic options. We've already had the vote to leave or remain so the current deal or hard brexit should be the only 2 options |  | | |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:20 - Dec 11 with 3808 views | wkj |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:02 - Dec 11 by Herbivore |
You say it would be democratic not to include remain on the ballot, I disagree given that 15m plus people voted remain last time and would want to again. You can't just bracket off nearly half the electorate like that and claim democracy. |
I am a remain voter, but in my mind Leave vs Remain has been answered already, its now more about the terms. Are their enough leave voters who feel the type of deal on offer would make them prefer voting remain? I doubt it to be honest.
Don't get me wrong, I would love to see a remain option, and see it win - but if there isn't I would understand why. [Post edited 11 Dec 2018 17:21]
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:33 - Dec 11 with 3768 views | Herbivore |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:20 - Dec 11 by wkj |
I am a remain voter, but in my mind Leave vs Remain has been answered already, its now more about the terms. Are their enough leave voters who feel the type of deal on offer would make them prefer voting remain? I doubt it to be honest.
Don't get me wrong, I would love to see a remain option, and see it win - but if there isn't I would understand why. [Post edited 11 Dec 2018 17:21]
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I don't see it that way. I'm not sure a one off referendum with a result that close is sufficient to answer the question, especially when you factor in that nobody really knew what Brexit would look like and that the leave campaign has been shown to be based on fiction and dodgy funding. It's perfectly democratic to have another vote now more is known about what is actually on the table. All polling shows remain with a lead now, most of the public want to stay. To remove that from the ballot because 'it lost' makes no sense, democracy isn't the FA Cup. You can't exclude a large portion, probably a majority of, the electorate from the process on the basis of the 2016 referendum. That would be wholly undemocratic imo. | |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:34 - Dec 11 with 3760 views | Herbivore |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:19 - Dec 11 by BloomBlue |
That would be the correct democratic options. We've already had the vote to leave or remain so the current deal or hard brexit should be the only 2 options |
That would be the very opposite of being democratic. | |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:37 - Dec 11 with 3764 views | PJH |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:34 - Dec 11 by Herbivore |
That would be the very opposite of being democratic. |
If there was another referendum and Remain won then they could either make it "best of five" or "first to ten wins".
Maybe have one a month. |  | | |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:41 - Dec 11 with 3744 views | GeoffSentence |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:37 - Dec 11 by PJH |
If there was another referendum and Remain won then they could either make it "best of five" or "first to ten wins".
Maybe have one a month. |
When there was material change that made it worth considering again perhaps. In the current case there is a material change in that we now know a lot more about what it entails than last time.
Also worth remembering that Brexiteer in chief Farage advocated a second referendum in the event of a narrow result, which he defined as 52-48, so this would be in line with brexiteer wishes. Though, of course he only said it as he was expecting the result to go the other way. | |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:41 - Dec 11 with 3736 views | Herbivore |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:37 - Dec 11 by PJH |
If there was another referendum and Remain won then they could either make it "best of five" or "first to ten wins".
Maybe have one a month. |
They could, although they'd probably spend their time better by actually governing the country as they've not done much of that the past 3 years. | |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:51 - Dec 11 with 3725 views | XYZ |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:19 - Dec 11 by BloomBlue |
That would be the correct democratic options. We've already had the vote to leave or remain so the current deal or hard brexit should be the only 2 options |
It about what options are open to us within the law of the UK and the law of the EU.
Withdrawing Article 50 by a vote of Parliament is a democratic option.
Extending A50 period with EU agreement is a democratic option.
Holding an in/ out second referendum is a democratic option.
No deal breaches a Treaty the UK is party to and is not, therefore a democratic option.
May's deal looks likely to fail to be passed, democratically.
The PM will be advised the "No deal" is a threat to national security.
Are you a democrat? [Post edited 11 Dec 2018 17:53]
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 18:26 - Dec 11 with 3664 views | Marshalls_Mullet |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:34 - Dec 11 by Herbivore |
That would be the very opposite of being democratic. |
How? |  |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 18:44 - Dec 11 with 3618 views | homer_123 |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:33 - Dec 11 by Herbivore |
I don't see it that way. I'm not sure a one off referendum with a result that close is sufficient to answer the question, especially when you factor in that nobody really knew what Brexit would look like and that the leave campaign has been shown to be based on fiction and dodgy funding. It's perfectly democratic to have another vote now more is known about what is actually on the table. All polling shows remain with a lead now, most of the public want to stay. To remove that from the ballot because 'it lost' makes no sense, democracy isn't the FA Cup. You can't exclude a large portion, probably a majority of, the electorate from the process on the basis of the 2016 referendum. That would be wholly undemocratic imo. |
Polls have been wrong, very wrong in fact, before.
It's one of the reasons why we are in this mess. Cameron et al utterly misread the political landscape...I wonder if there are still far too many assumptions being made about how people will vote?
What's 'materially' changed for those individuals who voted leave before? Are they better off personally? Do they see a better future for their family and a children now than 2 years ago? Is the gap between the haves and have nots dwindling? Has there been a refocuses on the City and distribution of wealth? Are the views of minorities more greatly listened to than 2 years ago?
The polls, at best, show some minor swings, some of which are well within statistical noise.
If a second vote comes in and Leave wins but with a smaller turnout but similar majority, what then?
If Remain wins by a big margin, then far less of a problem potentially. |  |
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| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 18:48 - Dec 11 with 3608 views | Currie10 |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:20 - Dec 11 by wkj |
I am a remain voter, but in my mind Leave vs Remain has been answered already, its now more about the terms. Are their enough leave voters who feel the type of deal on offer would make them prefer voting remain? I doubt it to be honest.
Don't get me wrong, I would love to see a remain option, and see it win - but if there isn't I would understand why. [Post edited 11 Dec 2018 17:21]
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Finally, a remainer who can accept a democratic vote.
Good for you. |  | | |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 18:50 - Dec 11 with 3599 views | Currie10 |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 17:33 - Dec 11 by Herbivore |
I don't see it that way. I'm not sure a one off referendum with a result that close is sufficient to answer the question, especially when you factor in that nobody really knew what Brexit would look like and that the leave campaign has been shown to be based on fiction and dodgy funding. It's perfectly democratic to have another vote now more is known about what is actually on the table. All polling shows remain with a lead now, most of the public want to stay. To remove that from the ballot because 'it lost' makes no sense, democracy isn't the FA Cup. You can't exclude a large portion, probably a majority of, the electorate from the process on the basis of the 2016 referendum. That would be wholly undemocratic imo. |
Prefer best of 851 to make sure?? | | | |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 18:50 - Dec 11 with 3599 views | SpruceMoose |
| A second referendum is looking more likely by the day on 18:48 - Dec 11 by Currie10 |
Finally, a remainer who can accept a democratic vote.
Good for you. |
I'm yet to see a leaver who actually understands democracy, or at the very least, doesn't willfully misrepresent it. |  |
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"Imagine being a heterosexual white male in Britain at this moment. How bad is that. Everything you say is racist, everything you say is homophobic. The Woke community have really f****d this country." | | Poll: | Selectamod |
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